Oh and of course I forgot about shen hao who also makes 8x10.
Oh and of course I forgot about shen hao who also makes 8x10.
Wow!
Don't even bother.
This bunch has it all figured out for you.
Group think at work.
The Viewfinder is the Soul of the Camera
If you don't believe it, look into an 8x10 viewfinder!
Dan
Thank you all for your replies, I'll try to get to everybody. I appreciate the clarity, kindness, civility and thought that went into all these responses.
You are not being rude Part of my thinking was that if an 8x10 is under the cost of say, a Canon Rebel, then a lot of photographers who may not have decided to do so, would go for one. I also think that 4x5s are a no-go because the used market is so saturated, but I've had trouble finding 8x10s at decent prices in good condition. As far as the lens, I was thinking get in good with a lensmaker, and get some good, sharp, if slow, glass made, perhaps with a gravity shutter to keep costs down. $500 may be ambitious for the body, but my ultimate dream of $1000 for an out-of-the-box 8x10 experience, from picture to print, is even more so.
I simply don't see 8x10s, new or used, at this price point, and I think it's doable.
Profitable? Maybe not. But I kind of don't mind if I just break even. If I had millions, I'd be happy to spend some of it to give 8x10 to a wider audience. But I don't
Good suggestions on manufacturing; and I am thinking that wood and a few good carpentry jigs may be good enough without going the ABS route. The ABS thing, especially with metal reinforcement, would make for a very robust camera that could shrug off just about anything. But wood has been fine forever too. Yes, the GG and bellows would be a pain, but I'm sure there are solutions. And as far as manufacturing overseas, I'd like to do as little of that as I can.
Small indeed, though I hope the affordability would draw in those who wouldn't consider it otherwise. I agree, lenses are a sticking point. I am sure Canhams are wonderful, but my goal is to push the price point down into the realm of relative affordability. Thanks for the well-wishes!
Using the Bender as inspiration but not a blueprint, I was thinking of an 8x10 that's very light and very inexpensive, but provides a wealth of movements on both standards. I fixed up my own 8x10 as well, and I'm lucky that I'm only about a grand into it all-told. If not for finding it through a friend, who only sat it on a shelf to admire, I'd have likely never had one at all. That theoretical cheaper option is what I'm hoping to be able to do.
Very true that the market is shrinking, but I am wondering if this 8x10 can do for LF what the Holga did for film, so to speak. Only not as agressively terrible. I agree a design with good rigidity that doesn't have movement creep of any kind is essential. Thanks!
If there are masses upon masses of cheap 8x10s somewhere I haven't seen them. But I agree. The film can be quite prohibitive. I don't know what to do about that. Dry plate holder maybe?
Perhaps it would, and if I made the camera I'd like to offer holders, too. A $500 camera is small comfort when all the ancillaries are $1000+.
There is much work to be done to obtain an 8x10 photo start to finish. But that is as you say part of the fun
The film again. Agreed, though. 4x5 is really quite the sweet spot, but I don't want to enter that already saturated camera market. I think an 8x10 works, not just for contact prints or shooting on positive paper/plates, but to give people access to the world of truly big images. 8x10 really is markedly different. But I agree, it's not going to be easy to piece together a kit from the camera itself. Should a complete kit be the new goal? Would that draw in otherwise non-LF users?
Please, call me Erik.
Find me on: Flickr Pentaxforums RangeFinderForum
Omega View 45F Monorail, Super Graphic, Various Lenses (75, 90, 135, 150/265, 210)
Round two....
I like this reply. This isn't about making a billion dollars. Or even dollars. It's about spreading the popularity of Large Format. I just thought maybe building something that could be sold would be a good way to do it.
Not much, to be fair. I agree that's a long list, but again...I don't think anyone's taken the "build it inexpensively" approach. Those cameras all cost double or triple my target price, maybe more. And again, in the used market, I don't see good working 8x10s at the $500 mark. Maybe I'm not looking in the right places.
I agree 35mm has gone a bit nutty and good used 8x10 glass is right in line, price-wise. I have never bought a B&J but I have seen a few good ones.
As for the Rembrandt, that's an odd bird, but I can see the advantages. I am hoping the price was new enough, as far as mine was concerned.
I like the idea of a kit, or even open-sourcing a good design that just about anyone can build with basic tools. A turnkey camera would be ideal, but as I said before, I'm not looking to be a millionaire from this, I just want to see more 8x10s in the wild. Again, the rigidity issues aren't trivial but I think they can be sorted.
What I really want is an 8x10 for everyone.
I would be fine with that.
XRay film is sensitive to visible light. And a Pinhole lensboard would be an affordable "make it take pictures now" thing to include with a basic camera.
Harsh. Probably fair, but harsh. I trust you on manufacturing though. However, Schneider at least advertises they still make lenses that easily cover 8x10. Am I missing something? And 8x10 film is still made by Kodak, Fuji, Fomapan and Ilford.
I am aware that view cameras are not trivial to make. But not everything has to be built like a Sinar, either.
It will all start with a workable design. And I really want to try my hand at that. If I can't make it, fine. But you can't convince me not to try.
As the not-a-manufacturing-insider, I will take your word on the ABS and instead think more about things like carpentry jigs, and wood construction. I like the idea of making the more complicated parts for home builders. As far as the lens mount, that works too, and I was thinking of a gravity shutter as those are effective and cheap to make.
I agree a global market might be needed to find enough buyers to make the idea viable. But I also believe, perhaps wrongly so, that those cameras cost that because they are not made with a specific eye to affordability. They are built, and simply cost what they cost. There is a difference between a thing that is made, then made cheaper, and a thing that is designed to be inexpensive from the start. For instance, the former is represented by a Ford Falcon, and the second by a Type 1 Beetle. The beetle eschews the things it doesn't need, and makes the rest as efficiently as it can.
Please, call me Erik.
Find me on: Flickr Pentaxforums RangeFinderForum
Omega View 45F Monorail, Super Graphic, Various Lenses (75, 90, 135, 150/265, 210)
They do, and their 8x10s are quite lovely.
I did kind of ask for it though!
I am actually quite pleased with the responses. Except for a couple that seemed to be trying to tell me to simply forget about it and go back to playing angry birds, I think I got measured, thoughtful replies that helped to inform my worldview and my ideas on such a project like this.
But I will say, wether I start building them, make kits, make components, or open source an 8x10 and offer plans, I'm not likely to give up on this idea altogether.
Please, call me Erik.
Find me on: Flickr Pentaxforums RangeFinderForum
Omega View 45F Monorail, Super Graphic, Various Lenses (75, 90, 135, 150/265, 210)
It would be tough, but it could be done. Get your manufacturing process down and make a go of it. Spin casting may even be a viable option.
Questions and comments are always welcome
I'd buy one.
8 x10 is the pursuit of the art people, is willing to enjoy the lonely people, is the person who have a lot of dollars, is the body strong people, he belongs to the work of men.
You see how many such people around, this is your market.
Don't forget, also remove of them, don't like 8 x10 picture of people, and has 8 x10 of people.
This group is very little, if you want to do big business, give up the attempt and the best!
I would not let others get you down. Manufacturing is now easier than ever with things like consumer avaliable laser cutters and rapid prototyping using 3d printers. Heck, I had some custom lens boards made from carbon fiber for less than $9 and done in less than two days from initial email.
I strongly suggest looking at intrepid, they seems to be making a solid go of it.
I wholeheartedly applaud to your plans! If I hadn't ordered a new 8x10" field camera just a few days ago I'd surely say I want one.
Best Regards
Wilfried
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