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Thread: Big Changes in Yosemite

  1. #11
    LF/ULF Carbon Printer Jim Fitzgerald's Avatar
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    Re: Big Changes in Yosemite

    Yosemite to me is a very special place. I took some family members there for a day trip as this was all the time we had. I have a senior pass so the rates will not affect me. I donate regularly to the parks especially Yosemite. The entry fees must go up I agree. I encourage everyone to donate to the park system because their budget will be cut drastically. So when you go get coffee or spend money on things you really don't need consider how important the park system is. Send some money there way if you can.

  2. #12
    Vaughn's Avatar
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    Re: Big Changes in Yosemite

    The entrance fee for Redwood National Park is going up by a factor of 5. Fortunately the present fee is $0. Pretty amazing.

    No reasonable increase in fees will take care of the maintenance backlog. That, and adequate stafting, is something that needs to be addressed in the US budget. The current entry fees are reasonable
    "Landscapes exist in the material world yet soar in the realms of the spirit..." Tsung Ping, 5th Century China

  3. #13

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    Re: Big Changes in Yosemite

    I agree that the Parks need to be funded, but as someone who does his best but does not have much income, and who has done as much as he can already to give to the Parks even when not there, I do not agree that large increases in entrance fees are the answer. These lands do belong to all of us, and all of us should pay for them, even if we never go to them. They will only be there for us if we ever do decide to visit them if we take care of them. If we never do go to them, our children or great-great grandchildren might. And if we don't have or want kids, we still owe it to the future to take care of them. The billions of dollars in backlogged maintenance costs are our responsibility. I live not too far above the poverty line, but would be willing to pay an extra $10-$25 per year in taxes to solve this problem. I'd find a way to get along without it. If everyone paid a fraction of that rate, based on their income, the Parks and other lands would not need fees, and I believe they shouldn't have them.

    I also agree that people should be held accountable for any destruction they intentionally cause, or cause through wanton disregard for regulations. I work with kids, and I tell them that a one million dollar fine for littering would be okay with me. Littering is an act, and it can be avoided. I feel even more strongly about vandalism.

  4. #14

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    Re: Big Changes in Yosemite

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Kinzer View Post
    I agree that the Parks need to be funded, but as someone who does his best but does not have much income, and who has done as much as he can already to give to the Parks even when not there, I do not agree that large increases in entrance fees are the answer. These lands do belong to all of us, and all of us should pay for them, even if we never go to them. They will only be there for us if we ever do decide to visit them if we take care of them. If we never do go to them, our children or great-great grandchildren might. And if we don't have or want kids, we still owe it to the future to take care of them. The billions of dollars in backlogged maintenance costs are our responsibility. I live not too far above the poverty line, but would be willing to pay an extra $10-$25 per year in taxes to solve this problem. I'd find a way to get along without it. If everyone paid a fraction of that rate, based on their income, the Parks and other lands would not need fees, and I believe they shouldn't have them.

    I also agree that people should be held accountable for any destruction they intentionally cause, or cause through wanton disregard for regulations. I work with kids, and I tell them that a one million dollar fine for littering would be okay with me. Littering is an act, and it can be avoided. I feel even more strongly about vandalism.
    Sounds just fine - IF you start with cigarette butts.
    I tend to procrastinate on stuff. One of these days I'll do something about it.

  5. #15
    Randy Moe's Avatar
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    Re: Big Changes in Yosemite

    Perhaps we need to change. Visitors to Parks can easily make them better.

    1980 I arrived in Eugene Oregon by motorbike with little money. I was sick with fever. Had been on the road for months in winter. My friends took me in and cooked me a fantastic Vegan meal. I was far from being Vegan and still am not. I slept but was awakened by them hours before dawn. We drove for an hour or so then hiked into a deep woods. They said nothing. Before the hike, they insisted I and they stuff garbage bags in our pockets. At predawn in mist we found a hot spring and a cold spring with a log mixing pool. Not a tourist site but obviously well known. It was covered with beer cans and cigarette butts. First we got naked and soaked in the glorious pool. Then cleaned the area spotless. We needed those bags. Many bags.

    When done we lingered. Then a family approached our naked asses. We dressed, gathered our loot and left the site to them.

    No fees. No Rangers. No fences. Barely a path. No flash lites.

    My fever had broken and I was well.

    I sold my Triumph to them, found a ride to San Diego on a piece of paper in a shop and left. Then the story got better.

  6. #16

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    Re: Big Changes in Yosemite

    Nearly every city and large town in America has at least one park. My little town of Sheridan has half a dozen. They are free for everyone to use -- but only the taxpaying residents of Sheridan pay for their upkeep. Sure, a few jerks misuse them sometimes, but I'm sure I'll never hear anyone suggest we try to charge a fee. It comes out of our City taxes -- 100%.

    If we believe our National Parks are treasures, we should fully fund them through taxes, including enough funds to conserve and protect them. Many places inside and outside of National Parks limit access to areas -- in various ways -- to preserve them, but charging admission restricts people who have already paid taxes for the Parks, and then have to pay more!

  7. #17

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    Re: Big Changes in Yosemite

    Riff raff? Its those 30 foot motorhomes chugging along at 15 miles an hour in the middle of the road at 4 miles to the gallon of gas. And then the people sit inside at the campgrounds with their generators running. Maybe, they should charge by a persons carbon footprint! I think the problem lies more with the park administration like with the forest service- too many chiefs and specialists and not enough boots on the ground.

  8. #18

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    Re: Big Changes in Yosemite

    Quote Originally Posted by Thad Gerheim View Post
    not enough boots on the ground.
    If the FED adequately funded the Parks and Forests, etc. there would be more "boots on the ground". When I'm 20 miles from the nearest trailhead and find a landfill full of empty beer cans and lawn chairs hauled in on horseback, how can a management deal with it? How can they even find it? I once turned in a group of hunters years ago at Bandalier National Monument where hunting is illegal -- and CLEARLY posted. My friend and I saw them kill a herd of 20 wild burros. Hunters? Not really. Murderers. We were many miles from the nearest Ranger Station -- and unarmed. Get real. Quadrupling entrance fees won't come close to paying for the needs of the Parks, Monuments, Forests, Refuges, etc.

    FYI, the bastards copped a plea deal in Albuquerque Federal Court.

  9. #19
    Drew Wiley
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    Re: Big Changes in Yosemite

    The State of California is suing the NPS to prevent fees so high they effectively exclude people from lower incomes (who also pay taxes). Besides, for just ten bucks more ($80), they can buy an annual pass to the whole NPS system. I have a lifetime Geezer pass. I spent two weeks in Yos high country a year ago and never saw anyone else (other than my backpacking companion) for an entire week of it. In fact, for a significant part of the trip, no sign of a trail or fire pit or even route marking blaze or "duck". No signs of human presence at all except chips of obsidian from ancient bighorn sheep hunters. There are a lot of places like that in the Sierra, and can be even more stunning than Yos Valley itself. No, you can't drive to those kinds of places. But the simple fact is that Yos Valley is one of the main cash cows for the entire Park system - hence it's a smoggy smokey theme park in summer. I don't see that changing.

  10. #20

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    Re: Big Changes in Yosemite

    It's encouraging to see that others feel passionate about this. I don't know that that will solve the problem, but I appreciate reading folks' thoughts on this. To me, this is another example of a problem where we know the solution, and it's sound and not particularly difficult. It just doesn't happen because not enough people care enough to implement it.

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