Should nudes be allowed in Portrait threads?

[goamules]

This issue is not about censorship. It is about respect! We need to respect the situations and the views of others. Politeness in society has taken a back seat to rudeness and lack of respect for the opinions and views of others. The moderators unfortunately spend much of their time dealing with the lack thereof.

I have been making photos of nudes for years, some models were paid and some were friends. I have posted some of these nudes in the Nude thread and I started the Nudes with Small Format thread in the Lounge so that viewers would be aware of what to expect. I do this out of respect for the viewer.

I have many photos that could suitably be posted in the Large Format Landscape or the Old Things threads, but because of the shock value created by a nude appearing unexpectedly or inappropriately, I think it is only fair that the viewer be forewarned. This can be clear from the title on the thread.

I try to keep my nudes within good taste, not erotic and certainly not pornographic. The only negative reaction I have had is from the Feminists who complain that I am 'objectifying women' and presenting them as 'sexual objects.'

I appreciate your thoughtful and respectful practices. And I notice no one commented. The main posters on this thread are the 1 or 2 that really, really want to allow nudity, at any level, in a "regular portraits thread", no matter what.

This is standard for bogging down a decision, the most vocal will argue until the cows come home, and never give an inch. So instead, they start shifting the argument onto tangents like,
"what really is a portrait" and
"if you don't want to look, just don't" and
"Kids shouldn't be offended, they'll see nudity at some point in their life" and
"if you take nudity out, you need to also take out xyz shots..." and
"nudity is art, the body shouldn't offend....blah."

Rather than argue each of the above, I'll ask this; Why don't the moderators just make the most logical ruling, that is being asked for by a large portion of the members? That is, keep nudity in it's own thread, like "soft focus landscapes", "old barns", "post your waterfalls"....et al? Is it that hard, or do we want to please the few, most adept arguers, who have nothing else to do but continually fight this logical plan?

[Preston]

Why don't the moderators just make the most logical ruling, that is being asked for by a large portion of the members? That is, keep nudity in it's own thread, like "soft focus landscapes", "old barns", "post your waterfalls"....et al?

Agreed.

--P

[Greg Y]

"Rather than argue each of the above, I'll ask this; Why don't the moderators just make the most logical ruling, that is being asked for by a large portion of the members That is, keep nudity in it's own thread, like "soft focus landscapes", "old barns", "post your waterfalls"....et al? Is it that hard, or do we want to please the few, most adept arguers, who have nothing else to do but continually fight this logical plan?"

Garrett, If only it were that simple. But first, as the polls shows...it's not 'a large portion'...it's about 50/50. Second, it's not about 'putting' them anywhere...
Posters have chosen where they would place their images. So do you advocate having 'alt process nudes' 'small format nudes'? My last comment is that culturally in these times we see more nudity everywhere... ads, social media, & with wardrobe malfunctions during the singing of the national anthem, so why does this topic generate so much discussion....this is afterall a private forum we have the privilege of using, & not a public democratic forum?

[Tin Can]

We tried to run our artist only condo building by consensus.

It was hell.

Impossible, finally we agreed to normal condo rule by a board.

Agreed.

--P

[Corran]

If I take a portrait of an undraped model, it's a portrait, regardless of your opinion of the image.

- Leigh

I know it's pointless to argue with you, but:

YOUR opinion on an image you make is the last opinion that matters. The ONLY opinion that matters in art is the viewers.

[Greg Y]

"The ONLY opinion that matters in art is the viewers." Corran

Did you really say that?

[Corran]

Maybe I shouldn't be so final.

My point was I personally believe the meaning/labeling/feeling/etc. ascribed to art should be more of the viewers' opinion.

I would assume some would have issues if I posted nudes with a window looking outside in the landscape thread all day.

[Wayne]

There is no "regular portraits" thread, there are only "Portraits" threads.

I don't really care that much about this because I am on dialup internet at home, and rarely read the images threads. I have only occasionally dipped into them when I had a LOT of time on my hands which is not often. Despite my earlier attempts at humor I have not even looked at the portraits or nudes thread in many months. It took me 3 days recently to view and read the 2 monstrous x-ray threads. So I think I'm probably one of the least emotionally involved and the most logically inclined in this matter. Whatever happens, I won't even notice the change. I haven't even voted. But I may.

It seems entirely logical from my rather detached, principle-based view that people who want change be the ones to change, rather than trying to force change of behavior on a solid 50% of others who disagree. I respect the right of people who don't want to see or be associated with nudity. If you don't want to see your portraits mingled in a thread with nude portraits, start a thread explicitly for non-nude portraits. If you don't want to see nude portraits at all, don't view the thread that isn't explicitly labeled non-nude. What could be more simple and logical? Its much more simple and logical and even respectful than trying to force change on others because of your personal sensitivities.

I appreciate your thoughtful and respectful practices. And I notice no one commented. The main posters on this thread are the 1 or 2 that really, really want to allow nudity, at any level, in a "regular portraits thread", no matter what.

This is standard for bogging down a decision, the most vocal will argue until the cows come home, and never give an inch. So instead, they start shifting the argument onto tangents like,
"what really is a portrait" and
"if you don't want to look, just don't" and
"Kids shouldn't be offended, they'll see nudity at some point in their life" and
"if you take nudity out, you need to also take out xyz shots..." and
"nudity is art, the body shouldn't offend....blah."

Rather than argue each of the above, I'll ask this; Why don't the moderators just make the most logical ruling, that is being asked for by a large portion of the members? That is, keep nudity in it's own thread, like "soft focus landscapes", "old barns", "post your waterfalls"....et al? Is it that hard, or do we want to please the few, most adept arguers, who have nothing else to do but continually fight this logical plan?

[Marc B.]

Sex definitely sells!
The highest % viewed [image] category on LFPF, is...Drum roll please......'Nudes.'

Since images listed as 'Portraits' are listed monthly...ie; JAN Portraits, FEB Portraits, MAR Portraits, etc...
(and, among other names), the Portrait category is tougher to nail down.
Compiled from the "Image Sharing & Discussion" forum. Here is a brief rundown of activity/viewership,
average-per-month, of those individual sub-categories with 200,000 views or more.

1st) 'Nude,' Started 6-Dec-2010 *(The youngest thread here).
Views: 714,276 - over 29 months = 24,600 vpm, (views per month).

2nd) 'Large Format Landscapes,' Started 27-Dec-2008
Views: 1,149,083 - over 55 months = 20,900 vpm

3rd) 'What did you compose at Water’s Edge?' Started 5-Mar-2009
Views: 429,643 - over 52 months = 8,300 vpm

4th) 'Post your Trees,' Started 21-Jan-2008
Views: 492,173 - over 66 months = 7,500 vpm

5th) 'Post alternative techniques,' Started 17-Jul-2009
Views: 292,286 - over 48 months = 6,100 vpm

6th) 'Post your urban landscapes,' Started 15-Dec-2009
Views: 225,316 - over 43 months = 5,200 vpm

7th) 'Post your Architecture photographs,' Started 9-Jun-2008
Views: 287,360 - over 61 months = 4,700 vpm

8th) 'Flowers Anyone?' Started 8-Oct-2007 *(The oldest thread here).
Views: 314,273 - over 69 months = 4,600 vpm

To the Moderators...From the numbers above, be very careful not to make a 'Nude/Landscape' category.

Marc

[Tin Can]

Change my vote. Nudity for everyone. I went to nudist family event once, it was horrible...

Sex definitely sells! The highest % viewed category on LFPF, is...Drum roll please......'Nudes.'

Since images listed as 'Portraits' are listed monthly...ie; JAN Portraits, FEB Portraits, MAR Portraits, etc...
the Portrait category is tougher to nail down.
Compiled from the "Image Sharing & Discussion" forum. Here is a brief rundown of activity/viewership,
average-per-month, of those categories with 200,000 views or more.

1st) 'Nude,' Started 6-Dec-2010 *(The youngest thread here).
Views: 714,276 - over 29 months = 24,600 vpm, (views per month).

2nd) 'Large Format Landscapes,' Started 27-Dec-2008
Views: 1,149,083 - over 55 months = 20,900 vpm

3rd) 'What did you compose at Water’s Edge?' Started 5-Mar-2009
Views: 429,643 - over 52 months = 8,300 vpm

4th) 'Post your Trees,' Started 21-Jan-2008
Views: 492,173 - over 66 months = 7,500 vpm

5th) 'Post alternative techniques,' Started 17-Jul-2009
Views: 292,286 - over 48 months = 6,100 vpm

6th) 'Post your urban landscapes,' Started 15-Dec-2009
Views: 225,316 - over 43 months = 5,200 vpm

7th) 'Post your Architecture photographs,' Started 9-Jun-2008
Views: 287,360 - over 61 months = 4,700 vpm

8th) 'Flowers Anyone,' Started 8-Oct-2007 *(The oldest thread here).
Views: 314,273 - over 69 months = 4,600 vpm

Marc