Why are 8x10 and up film holders so expensive?

[Paul Ewins]

Actually I don't see 3D printed holders as saleable objects, it is definitely a DIY thing. The current hobbyist printers probably don't have the required resolution but the commercial ones are definitely there. The big difference is that film holders are almost all identical save for the dimensions, so that once you have a model made for one size it should be trivial to alter it for another size. All this assumes that a suitable plastic is available.

Looking at a Fidelity 8x10 holder, the parts list would be 1 x centre divider (cut from sheet), 2 x dark slide (cut from sheet), 2 x dark slide handles (2 pieces each, printed), film holder body with integral film guides (2 identical pieces, printed), 2 x end flaps (printed), tape for end flaps, glue for assembly. Putting that together wouldn't be rocket science, it wouldn't even be stone axe science.

[Oren Grad]

Looking at a Fidelity 8x10 holder, the parts list would be 1 x centre divider (cut from sheet), 2 x dark slide (cut from sheet), 2 x dark slide handles (2 pieces each, printed), film holder body with integral film guides (2 identical pieces, printed), 2 x end flaps (printed), tape for end flaps, glue for assembly. Putting that together wouldn't be rocket science, it wouldn't even be stone axe science.

Well, maybe we can get a handle on it, so to speak. Leaving out the non-printer parts, how many cubic cm of raw material do you reckon that adds up to?

[Paul Ewins]

At most, 425cc but probably closer to 400cc for an 8x10. A rough scale up to 12 x 15 was around 620cc and I guess a 16x20 would be closer to 900cc if the overall thickness stayed the same (19mm or 3/4") and the sides and ends got a little broader. Going by the shapeways price - $1.40cc - this is way too expensive. However the black ABS filament used in the hobbyist printers is actually quite cheap, maybe $50 kg, so I would guess that most of that cost is actually overhead not materials. If you were making three or four holders at the same time then economies of scale might start to tip in your favour. I don't think it will ever be viable for 8x10 and smaller, but ULF and specialty sizes may be different.

[Vaughn]

Anybody can make a film holder. Not many can make one worth using.

It might take less than $400 worth of time and material to make a good one, but people probably charge more just to have to put up with the 'Ultracrepidarians'. LOL!

[Steve Smith]

I wonder whether it would be possible to design a film holder that could be made with a 3D printer.

If I was going to do design a plastic film holder (which I'm not!) I would see if I could make it with a plastic extrusion to eliminate much of the slot cutting.


Steve.

[jnantz]

i've made holders before, out of cardstock and foam core and other materials ... 11x14 and smaller sizes.
it took very little time and worked very well, and cost me about 2hours work and about 20$ worth of materials... ( for 5 or 6 holders )

alibaba can connect you with people all over the world who have the manufacturing experience to make film holders
for mass production for you .. its just a matter of making a prototype, and making sure the samples sent out for spec-check
are the same things being made. it would be a real drag if custom made film holders from the far east turned everyone's film pink
like the chinese amidol did ...

[Linhof]

demand is much bigger than supply!

[RichardRitter]

$400 for a used wooden 11x14 film holder?

C'mon. $20 worth of wood and a few hours worth of work??

No fuckin' way. I'm sure someone with rudimentary wood working skills can make these for $50 all day long.

Well its like this first the wood has to be of the best quality. Finding the best quality makes a lot of kindling and ups the cost of the holder

Then there is the fact that there are over 150 different set ups to make a holder each set up taking about an hour or more to get it right. All set ups having to be of very tight tolerances to prevent light leaks and most important is the placement of the film in the holder to the ground glass. This can make more kindling that just gets more costly the more time and set ups you have into the parts.

The side rials that are the most important part of the holder has 20 plus operation to it. The groves have to be parallel to the edge and with in a 0.005 tolerance. Just one little slip, set sometime up wrong, build up of dust, the list goes on on what can make parts no good and the parts that have hours of time into then are scrape, very costly kindling.

Why not make then in plastic the molds to make the parts is a small fortune and you would have to make a lot of pats to justify the cost.

I work part time in a high end custom door and window shop, the shop use to make cameras for me when I was at Zone VI there is only one person in that shop who would even think of trying to making the holder. But he knows better and will not touch then with a ten foot board. The shop has 5 master wood workers, they all looked at a holder and said no way once they found out about the tolerances. Yes they are all capable of making the holder.

I have ran the cost figures on making holders and had then double checked by the person that made the Zone VI cameras and we came up with there is about $90 worth of materials in a 11 x 14 holder and about 6 hours time per holder if you made a dozen holders. If may math is right that works out to $390 at $50 per hour labor plus materials. This is does not take into the fact that some custom tooling would have to made and custom fixtures would have to be made to insure the tight tolerances to make the holders.

[Brian C. Miller]

$400 for a used wooden 11x14 film holder?

C'mon. $20 worth of wood and a few hours worth of work??

No fuckin' way. I'm sure someone with rudimentary wood working skills can make these for $50 all day long.

You missed this thread? Cheap 11x14 film holders on ebay

[CP Goerz]

Weren't Fidelity's prices on 11x14 holders back in the day in the $$$ region? And they were plastic holder makers with all the tools at their disposal. Good luck on getting a call back from the owner.....