Little problem, help!

[drums1977]

I shot my first colour film in LF recently. I've had no problem with BW, wich I process myself. These colour plates I sent to the lab, and they came back like this (see attachments).

What do you think those red stains are? The look like light leaks to me but, did they happen during the loading of the holders (at home), or after the film was exposed (either at the lab or at home? They dont seem to have happened during exposure in the camera, since the actual image is perfectly sharp and exposed. Could it be due to faulty film? Xray eposure upon shipping to/from the lab?

This is the first time I use this lab for LF (I used them a lot for MF), so maybe they are not that used to big pieces of film. What is your expert opinion?

Thanks so much!

[lenser]

I get the impression that the problems on the last image look like large liquid staining as if they were tray processed and either large flat bubbles occurred or that they were in contact with other sheets that trapped pockets of chemistry without constant agitation or kept the chemistry from flowing where it was needed for the full term of that step in the sequence which would produce a difference tonality than those parts that did get properly exposed to the chemistry.

They have no straight edges in that one but are rather rounded as liquid would be. Light leaks would not have a rounded form but rather have very straight edges.

I would ask the lab (before showing them these results) what equipment they used to process these. If they say trays, show them these and ask if they were left to sit without proper agitation. In that case, I would look for another source for all of my processing.

It could well be that they do not have the proper equipment to handle large format and that they tried this in trays as a favor to you but missed the agitation and sheet separation needs.

[Greg Blank]

Its a light strike. Straight edges or not. The only reason a light strike would have straight edges is "IF" there was something close to the film when it was struck. A hole in a changing bag produces that result gauranteed.

[drums1977]

Its a light strike. Straight edges or not. The only reason a light strike would have straight edges is "IF" there was something close to the film when it was struck. A hole in a changing bag produces that result gauranteed.

They look like light leaks to me too. I am not sure about the chemicals theory, as the images are good (no uneven development, the images ARE there alright). I am quite confused. I am always very careful when loading/unloading holders. Never have a problem in BW. Maybe the door of my darkroom wasn't completely sealed? When I unloaded the exposed film I just put it back un the original film box, which I kept untouched. I didn't put the film in any kind of wrap or bag before putting it in the box, I mean, the film was "bare" in the box. That is the normal procedure to send film to the lab, isn't it? (as I said, this is the first time I send LF to eh lab, until now I processed it myself). Maybe the leak happened upon manipulation at the lab? As the images are perfectly exposed, I reccon the leak happened AFTER exposure, does that make sense? Ive also thought about the holders, could they be the problem?

Thanks so much for your valuable help!

[drums1977]

Just talked to the lab, and they say that the problem is the fact that I did not put the film in a light sealed bag and then in the kodak box. They say that the box alone is not enough to keep the light out. Did you ever have that kind of problem?

[ROL]

Just talked to the lab, and they say that the problem is the fact that I did not put the film in a light sealed bag and then in the kodak box. They say that the box alone is not enough to keep the light out. Did you ever have that kind of problem?

Yes! I wrote about this (Film –> Triple Boxes) last year on my site. What?!? You don't go to my site first with your little problems?

...Another solution is to tape up your inner triple "exposed" boxes with light proof tape (i.e., gaffers).

[drums1977]

Yes! I wrote about this (Film –> Triple Boxes) last year on my site. What?!? You don't go to my site first with your little problems?

...Another solution is to tape up your inner triple "exposed" boxes with light proof tape (i.e., gaffers).

Very interesting, thank you so much ( I have to admit I did not know your webpage...). Yes, I am a bit suspicious about the lab's version. I am starting to consider lots of possibilities. The marks in the images are caused by light, I am quite positive. I also think they were caused AFTER the exposure of the film, since the pictures are fine. Maybe my darkroom wasn't COMPLETELY light tight? Maybe I left a tiny leak which I did not notice but strong enough to expose the film upon unloading the holders? I keep my boxes in the fridge, could the light there somehow damage brand new sealed boxes of film? The box is a standard current Kodak 10 sheet triple box, whick looks perfect and its not squashed or damaged in any manner. The leaks are severe, compared for instance with the ine in ROL's article, and they come from all directions. Could the box have leaks in all four sides?!

I attach a detail of one of the leaks. Maybe this will help you experts resolve the mystery: In a couple of images, the "leak" have a special pattern, some kind of bent grid! Take a look at the attached image.

Thank you all. I have to know if I should use this lab in the future or not...

[ROL]

The source of the problem might be anywhere at this point, and you are right not to discount anything until you have eliminated possibilities. A methodical approach solved my specific issue, one that I had not seen or encountered before. If you take nothing else from my story, at least appreciate that these kinds of issues are often only solved with a very logical look at your particular workflow. Maybe invite someone who can objectively watch you work, from film loading through shooting, to developing.

Should the issue eventually be narrowed down to your boxes, light may be entering from anywhere they may be compromised – corners and sides most often. But you can easily eliminate the boxes as the problem right off, by simply definitively making them "lightproof" or dark bagging your exposures at little or no cost.

If nothing pans out, go ahead and blame the f%#$ing lab! I'm sure they will be happy to have you develop your own film...

[drums1977]

Believe me, I dont want to blame the lab, since I have been working with them for a couple of years already with good results in MF and 35mm. Large format processing stores in Spain are becoming rare and expensive. I just want to know what went wrong.

Today I delevopped 12 plates in BW at home. I used the same holders, camera, lenses, work flow until I took the film tout of the holders (it went direct into a paterson tank instead than going into the film box). All the images seem flawless.

Does the shape of the stain in the last image I attached give you guys any ideas?

[Lynn Jones]

Just talked to the lab, and they say that the problem is the fact that I did not put the film in a light sealed bag and then in the kodak box. They say that the box alone is not enough to keep the light out. Did you ever have that kind of problem?

Hi drums1977,

If your film box is a standard three piece box your lab is not telling you the truth, I've used these Kodak, Fuji, and other sheet film boxes since the early 1950's, some times in a black bag sometimes not with no fogging.

The last time I saw your problem, one of my students sent film in and it turned out that he had a "Walkman" on his belt and the light from it fogged the film, the same thing can happen with any of the "android" devices or what have you. In my case, naturally he denied it but when called in by the lab manager, he still had the device on his belt. This can happen if the tech has been in daylight and is only in total darkness briefly where he wouldn't notice the small amount of light was reflecting up toward his shirt. However, for safety's sake, I would use the black bag, because in other situations, the lab the tech may accidentally open the outside box.

Lynn