FP4 base side anomalies and Jobo 3005

[Sal Santamaura]

...jobo are not available and the ones that are out there will stop working because they cannot be maintained because parts are not available. So any jobo that is out there cannot be maintained to perform as designed since they can't be maintained as designed...

All things will break, but Jobo does still supply replacement parts. Used CPA/CPP/Autolab processors are obtainable on the used market. And, Jobo still manufactures and sells 3005 Expert drums brand new. See this post from yesterday for someone who purchased one:

http://www.apug.org/forums/viewpost.php?p=1288169

...The smart person is planning for a future of home processing using non-kodak products and using non-jobo...

I've always valued planning ahead. While I respect, admire, use and defend Ilford's top-quality products, far in the future there will be a time when even Ilford joins Kodak in the history books. Therefore, back in 2005, I stockpiled many thousands of sheets of Azo paper. I also purchased two Jobo processors, a CPA-2 and CPP-2, so as to have a spare for when parts eventually do become unavailable, along with a collection of tanks and Expert drums. Finally, I have obtained and placed in our freezer a large quantity of 320TXP sheet film. Taken together, these are my "doomsday" supplies. I don't anticipate needing to use them for many, many years.

...does anyone really expect there to be ANY reliable jobo units running to 100% factory spec in 5 years????? 10 years????? 15years?????...

I do. As with all electromechanical equipment, the probability of this happening is dependent on carefulness and intensity of use as well as availability of repair parts. Expert drums, if properly handled, should not have any problem lasting many times as long as 15 years. If the processor fails, see this thread for a possible alternative that would keep Jobo drums and tanks usable:

http://www.apug.org/forums/forum172/...last-legs.html

Finally, if one wants to avoid rotary processing entirely, I'd set my sights on one of these systems:

http://www.alistairinglis.com/new_page_1.htm

[johnielvis]

rdenny---I know....a tank is the best probably but the chemical volume is prohibitive...I don'tt want to buy and maintain a dip and dunk.....that would be the cadillac solution, but I want something that can be used at home....there has to be some way to get these drums to work properly--it must be drums I'm thinking---same as a tray but just curled...but trays do scratch too...I want something foolproof, you know....I'll find a solution--I'm just hoping I find people who are just as dissatisfied as me and we can bouce ideas off each other to get it going....oh and I will continue to learn as you do...yes I will---but I don't want to rely on technology--I want to rely on simplicity and genius-type solutions---something simple that anybody can make---a "home contrivance" type of thing....OR...maybe technology will provide the MATERIALS which will allow a nicer, simpler, more elegant solution....THAT is where I'll allow technology...materials...but NOT in mechanization....no way....I hate the contraptions which Is why I hate the jobo...I want an ak47 that shoots all the time, not some snooty lugar that jams, you know?


to the sal santorum dude--I do learn and I've learned that jobo aint the future for me or the world---it is for you--good keep it Idon't want it. I'm gonna find me something better---now go to bed with your jobo and stop the trolling....you should maybe get a job or something

[Sal Santamaura]

...to the sal santorum dude--I do learn and I've learned that jobo aint the future for me or the world---it is for you--good keep it Idon't want it. I'm gonna find me something better---now go to bed with your jobo and stop the trolling...

Calling me a troll is one thing; referring to me as "santorum" is a real insult.

Apparently you are unwilling to look at what I wrote one post up:

...Finally, if one wants to avoid rotary processing entirely, I'd set my sights on one of these systems:

http://www.alistairinglis.com/new_page_1.htm

That's not a Jobo. Not even rotary of any kind. It's a commercially available, daylight, gas-burst system from Alistair Inglis. Probably worth your effort to investigate.

[patrickjames]

I have put a lot of HP5 through a 3010 drum without any of the problems you mention. The negs come out very clean. You may want to slow down your drum rotation. That may eliminate some of the shifting it appears you have going on. I can't think of any other reason for the scratches you are getting.

I hope you can find a solution to the problem. I had sporadic problems with Pyrocat until I finally just decided that it wasn't worth the hassle and went back to Rodinal so I know how you feel.

[johnielvis]

large tanks with hangers that take huge amounts of chemistry are out of the questions...I want home apartment processing

if I wanted to use the machine I'd hire a lab.

my process needs one-shot---fresh developer every time....can't fill a tank with gallons every time...too wasteful....the equipment is too big....

I'd hire a lab if I wanted that...but I don't want to hire a lab..I want HOME processing...you take it down so you can take a shower kind of stuff...just like everyone else wants.

I have tried tanks....too much chemicals....like I said i've tried it ALL...I want something NEW..please stop suggesting what's already out there...it don't work for me

[johnielvis]

GOTIT
....see the other thread on processing equipment....

I figureed out you need 100% contact with the developing/rinse fluid to get off the anit-halation layer----this means S L O W rotation to ensure liquid stays at the bottom of the tube trough AND sufficient chemicals to submerge the part of the film on the bottom....

So--advise using more developer if you don't have enough in there for full contact...if you DO, then you're spinning it too fast.....

I ran one of these opened up and saw what was going on in there.....

see the other thread under processing equpment....

I don't know how the jobos work with the multi chamber though but suffice it to say...the film MUST get full ly submerged to evenly remove the antihalation dyes/backing----this is the result of experimentation and my observations of the moving rolling drum with liquid and film it.

[Jw35180]

So you had the issue with Ilford films? I pushed Tri-X to the bottom of the drums and maybe anti-halation didn't always come out on its own, but never any of these strange almost textured patterns on the base side.

Hello Jordan,

I just started having this issue with fp4 using the jobo 3010. Did you ever resolve the problem

Thx
Jim

[ic-racer]

https://www.largeformatphotography.i...ght=jobo+marks

No processing related marks since 2015 when I figured that out.

[Jw35180]

https://www.largeformatphotography.i...ght=jobo+marks

No processing related marks since 2015 when I figured that out.

Thx, good work.

I’ve run multiple tests, interestingly, eliminating the prewash appears to have fixed my problem. I’ve run through 10 development cycles, half with and half without the prewash. In all cases the batches without the prewash didn’t have the problem. If I develop Tri-x with or without a prewash I’ve never had a problem. I’ve only had the issue with fp4 and delta, never tri-x or tmax. I talked to a photographer that tray developes his film, he has noted a change in the fp4 film base. Nothing equivalent to the marks associated with the jobo. But the base was duller, less shiny. I do think your analysis maybe correct, but my success by foregoing the prewash is a puzzle. Going forward, I plan to use tri-x. All of this seems to suggest an issue with fp4. My tests are limited but they do seem to be repeatable

[Jos S]

I have succesfully processed hundreds of FP4+ rolfilms in a JOBO tank since 1978. Never had any issues. A few films that I processed lately show some few very thin irregular scratches in the emulsion. This puzzles me because these defects are definitely not from my own handling.