Ancient Voigtlander

[Two23]

I've been trying to get a lens from the 1840s for about a year & half now. I've snagged a couple of lenses from the 1850s; those aren't terribly hard to find. An verifiable 1840s lens has been much more elusive for me! I've only seen two for sale, and barely missed both. Finally, last Saturday I managed to grab one off eBay. The seller didn't clean it up any and refused to try & take it apart. He wasn't a camera guy, but just found the lens in an attic where it had sat undisturbed since about 1923. His photos were poor. I went ahead and got it for about $600. I put some PB Blaster (similar to WD-40) on the threads and let it soak all day. That evening the hood easily unscrewed and also the front & rear lens groups. The focus knob is stiff but works. The flange is soldered on. The serial number of 2942 dates the lens to about 1847, and the engraving reads "Voigtlander & Son in Wien", not Braunschwieg. Note how small the focus knob is. The diameter of front group is 53mm, the rear is 56mm. FFL is about 6 inches. The lens is quite heavy for its size, 4.25 inches long & ~2.5 inches barrel diameter. Hood diameter is 3 & 1/8 inches, and it is 1.75 inches long. Length with hood is ~5.5 in. Note there was a "modification." Someone cut a section out of the collar so it would clear the tab of a Waterhouse slot, and also cut a very narrow slot into the barrel. Fortunately no engraving was lost. Lens seems to have most of its original finish but there are some corrosion spots. The glass is perfect; as good as my modern Nikon lenses! It seems to easily cover 4x5. I really like this lens! I think it's my new favorite.

I'm wondering what it's actually worth? I'm pretty sure I didn't overpay at $610, even with the cut out section on the collar. It's a very nice lens, and you just don't find Voigtlanders this old and this desirable a size very often anywhere. Any thoughts on this historic lens? I know we have some solid Petzval experts here.



Kent in SD

[Steven Tribe]

Nice!
Probably is just late 1840's.
The engraving is almost identical with that on serial number 234 - just a slight change in the "tails" of a few of the letters.
4,000 was approximately the change to Braunschweig (1852?) so yours could be in the period 1847 - 1848 (OK, I see now you put this date on it too!).
If you can measure the focal length and the diameter of the front lens (glass) , I could see if it matches with a listed size.
Modifications of this type do not influence the value.

[CCHarrison]

On Voigtlanders, I have found only 3 digit serial numbers (or low 1000's) significantly increase the value over "just" an older Voigtlander Petzval. From a collectors standpoint, that cut does lower the value and interest. Someone looking to mount a proper period lens to a Daguerreotype camera would (typically) not settle on one that was cut. From a users standpoint, it matters much less IMO.

Best,
Dan

[goamules]

Congratulations Kent. I watched this one too, but had just bought an early Ross, and was out of money. Good for you!

[Two23]

Thanks for the info. I did assume the cut for the stop and missing collar section killed the value for hard core collectors, and wasn't aware that a Voigtlander had to be numbered under 1,000 to be REALLY interesting. I was a bit surprised that only one other person bid, and it seems to me that it went so cheap considering it's in good shape (except for modifications) and it's c.1847. I think the more serious buyers were put off by the modifications, and the less knowledgeable buyers didn't want to take a risk based on the poor photos and the fact the seller refused to even try to get the hood & lens groups apart. Since I fall right between a rank newbie and a hardcore collector, I was in luck here! For me, the important thing is I have a very usuable and decent looking lens from the dawn of photography, the Dag era. My excitement comes not from perfection, but from owning and taking photos with something from so long ago! It's my connection with people & times of long ago.

Steven--

Rear group measures 55mm. Front group measures 53mm. FL is 6.25 inches, measured from rear of lens. From center of lens it's right at 8 inches. Seems to cover 4x5 OK. Weight is 1.9 lb; 0.85 kg.


Kent in SD

[goamules]

I agree with the feeling of excitement when using an early lens. And remember, Voigtlander made the first Petzvals so you've got the lens that started it all! I have an 1855 that is "Ole Reliable" for me.

[Steven Tribe]

Looks like we have a match!
No. 2 on the first catalogue that I know of says.

Focal length 7 1/3 zoll (inch). Lens diameter 52mm and 55mm. Bildformat zoll (Inch) 5 1/2. Voigtländer were still listing for a square format at this time!
Note: size 2 on older lenses (yours) shold be adjusted by 4 Thir because of the difference in optical and chemical focus. What a Thir is, I have no idea!