Toyo 45A and Toyo 45CF Field Cameras

[John Rodriguez]

I've been using a CF for the past 7 months (first LF camera) that I bought second hand.

Positives:
- Light
- Sturdy: I haven't had any issues with vibration or build quality save one - the tabs that hold the back in place are made of a soft metal, if you were ham fisted with it over a long period of time I could see them getting damaged.
- Folds with a lens in place
- Folds fairly compact
- Folds/unfolds quickly

Negatives
- No back movements: not much of an issue for me. I've only come across one shot where I thought some back movement would be nice. I never had/needed back movements using tilt/shift lenses so I'm used to it.
- No fine control mechanism for tilt/swing. Not something most field cameras have anyways, but I've thought about going to a Wista field for this reason. In practice this hasn't been an issue, but it would speed up the focusing process.

I don't consider the lack of a fresnel to be a problem; I find the stock ground glass plenty bright enough for landscape work.

[Joseph Dickerson]

Hi again,

Sorry I didn't respond quicker.

I think that $399 for a Sinar F2 is one hell of a price.

The F2 is only a pound of so heavier than the F/F1 but has a couple of advantages. First the swings and shift are on separate locks. On the F/F1 there is only one lock for both movements. Also the F2 has front knob focussing while on the F/F1 you have to unlock the whole front standard and shift it to focus. Also the F2 front standard is a little more robust.

These are not huge differences but do contribute to the F2 being favored over the F/F1.

I, and a lot of others on this forum, prefer a monorail for field use and the Sinar F series is one of the best for field use, but is no slouch in the studio either. Another advantage, some would say disadvantage, is that the Sinar cameras can be upgraded ad infinity. Most parts are completely interchangeable.

I occasionally let my students use my F1 in our studio and so far they haven't been able to break anything. I do keep my fingers crossed though.

There are currently a couple of F2s on ebay offered at $550 so I think $399 if not a steal, is certainly a bargain. That seems to be about what F/F1s are going for.

You can search "Sinar F" on this forum and you'll come up with lots of good info.

Perhaps Jim Petronio will share some of his well respected insights as well.

JD

[Peter De Smidt]

I think that $399 for a Sinar F2 is one hell of a price.

+1, assuming there are no condition "issues"! It's a terrific price. The great advantage of a Sinar is the huge number of used parts available.

[Joseph Dickerson]

Just re-read my post...that should of course be FRANK Petronio.

Sorry Frank.

JD

[tgtaylor]

Actually the CF does have a back movement but only one: When you drop the bed the back tilts back at a 15 degree angle without the ability to stop it at an intermediate angle. This means that the CF is not the camera to use for shooting skyscrappers (you need a forward tilt for that) but how many skyscrappers do you run across out in the backcountry anyway? The CF is primarily designed as a lightweight and rugged field camera and is particularily well suited for backcountry travel. While the bed drop movement is ill-suited for skyscrapers it will enable the savy landscaper to exagerate the size of objects in the foreground

Thomas

[Robert Oliver]

I backpack with 4x5 and found the Chamonix 45n-1 to be the ultimate mix of light weight, bellows draw and build quality.

I tried a bunch including the Toyo CF and 45A.

Never tried a Toho, but they seem to be a very lightweight option

[John Rodriguez]

I've been using a CF for the past 7 months (first LF camera) that I bought second hand.

Positives:
- Light
- Sturdy: I haven't had any issues with vibration or build quality save one - the tabs that hold the back in place are made of a soft metal, if you were ham fisted with it over a long period of time I could see them getting damaged.
- Folds with a lens in place
- Folds fairly compact
- Folds/unfolds quickly

Negatives
- No back movements: not much of an issue for me. I've only come across one shot where I thought some back movement would be nice. I never had/needed back movements using tilt/shift lenses so I'm used to it.
- No fine control mechanism for tilt/swing. Not something most field cameras have anyways, but I've thought about going to a Wista field for this reason. In practice this hasn't been an issue, but it would speed up the focusing process.

I don't consider the lack of a fresnel to be a problem; I find the stock ground glass plenty bright enough for landscape work.

As a follow up to this post for anyone that digs it up in a search - I've run into vibration problems with longer heavy lenses. When racked out the weight on the front causes the slightest impacts to result in a lot of vibration. With a Fujinon 250mm f/6.3 shots longer then 1 second come out OK, but anything shorter is almost always un-useable. With the lens mounted and focused, if I depress the shutter even lightly I can see the image move in the ground glass. This is likely due to the base the tripod socket is mounted to being made out of thermoplastic instead of metal. I'm not sure what the cut-off is, but a Fujinon 180mm f/5.6 in a copal 1 is fine. A light 210mm in a copal 0 would probably be ok too, but I don't think I'd go any longer.

Still, if you're fine with a 210mm being your longest lens it's a great camera for backpacking, especially since it folds with a lens mounted. I'm going to pick up a metal field, but I'll probably keep the CF for overnight trips.

[R-H-]

Although heavy, you will love the sturdiness of the metal Toyo.

[tgtaylor]

I've used my 45CF with 75mm (recessed lensboard with bed drop), 90mm f4.5 Grandragon (flat lensboard), 120mm Nikkor F9, 150mm, 210mm (Symmer-S), and 300mm Nikkor-M with no issues even when mounted on a Gitzo GT0540 tripod. However I do use a cable release and do my best to shield the camera from the wind.

Incidently the 75mm f4.5 Grandagon, 150mm Rodenstock apo Sirona-S, and 300mm Nikkor-M are ideal for traveling light with a minimal kit.

Thomas

[chassis]

In the six months I have owned a Toyo 45AII, I have taken it through airports across the US twice, and hiked beaches, forests and mountain trails. It is a great camera for field use, and I can't find anything negative to say about it. I use 58mm and 150mm lenses in the field, and haven't detected shake or vibration problems. With the 58mm lens, I use a 12mm recessed lensboard.

Indoors I use 150mm and also 11" (280mm) lenses for still life and portrait images. Again, no problems I have experienced with stability, or running out of camera movement for my type of photography. With the 11" lens I use a 4" extension back.

This is pretty close to a do-all camera at this stage of my photographic journey.