4x5 Velvia 50-First Outing

[Daniel Stone]

Some of MY best photographs made on REVERSAL(slide) film have been during high noon. That's when, IMO, the colors are "purest". Yes, dynamic range sucks, but I know that I'll be happy, cause I can represent those colors I see with my eyes faithfully. Our eyes don't see deep shadow detail when looking at the big picture, so why should I concern myself with getting super fine detail in all the deepest shadows? Sometimes I feel it adds dimension and scale, along with depth, to the photograph. I still have a nice stash of EPN Readyloads I'm slowly whittling down, and enjoying it actually more as they age! The contrast is slightly lowering, but I'm not seeing any increase in base fog, or grain size. These boxes are being stored in the back of a cool(under 70deg F) closet. So not in the freezer, much less a fridge.

here's an example taken almost exactly at noon:



-Dan

[Daniel Stone]

It really depends on HOW you want to portray what you're photographing. If you like what you see at high noon, when the sun is at its brightest and best , shoot it. If you want a softer, lower contrast representation, shoot it earlier, or later in the day. Or on a cloudy/overcast day with nice even, diffused light.

These two shots below were taken on the same day as the shot above, just once the sun had gone behind the hills to the west, so the light was soft and relatively even.





-Dan

[Ivan J. Eberle]

Astia 100F is MUCH easier to shoot in available light, has great saturation and very accurate color. Has the same or perhaps even finer grain and resolves to within a very few lp/mm of Velvia-- far better than LF lenses. No over-amped crossover blue in the shadows as with Provia. It swiftly supplanted Velvia 50 as my LF go-to E6 film. Still got a bunch of it in Quickloads.

[Laron]

Daniel, those are beautiful!!
by the way, good infos here!

[Harley Goldman]

Daniel, those are really sweet!! Beautifully done.

Ivan, I like Astia, as well but I am not real fond of the way it renders skies. I find them a little too yellow for my tastes. No such thing as a perfect film, they all have compromises.

[dperez]

Beautiful Giovanni! I definitely would have been concerned about Velvia for a scene like that - ND Grads would be key!

I just wanted to add that I am in complete agreement about white texture. About +1 2/3 stops (at ASA50) is as high as I would expose and hope to retain any texture, with it being pretty well pure white at +2.

Frustratingly, I can usually see detail below -2 stops but scanning it gets very difficult, so i don't count on using it.

I just wanted to reiterate what Tyler said here... Along with the narrow exposure latitude, one also has to think about their scanning process. Bringing the highlights down to within the +1 2/3 range from mid-tone is not always the biggest problem; it can be controlled to some extent with ND grad filters.* The problem I run into is bringing out shadow details during the scanning process. Unless one has access to a high quality scanner, it can be difficult to get the scanner to bring out the detail that can clearly be seen on the light table. Having a multi-exposure feature (as in Silverfast 8) in the scanner software might be the best solution outside of high-end drum scanning.

* Many times I find that the standard range of ND grads (1, 2, and 3 stops) are not adequate. One either has to stack ND grad filters or use a special 5-stop filter made by Singh-Ray.

-DP

[MumbleyJoe]

Expanding on this.....what is the exact difference between a ND Grad filter and an 81A warming filter......

And how do you decide where to place your medium gray?

Well, as I mentioned over on flickr I concern myself not so much with middle-gray, per se, but rather a few common elements that seem to come up again an again, namely...

Blue Sky - Best between Zone 5-6
Green Foliage - Best between Zone 4-6 (actually, about 1/3 stop lower on each end, like 3.7-5.7)
Dark Colors - Zone 3.5-5 (Deep Red, for example, like a fire hydrant)
Light Colors - Zone 6-6.5 (Light Yellow for example, autumn leaves)
White with Texture - Best about Zone 6.7 (nearly pure white by Zone 7)
Shadow with Texture - Best around Zone 3

So I look at what's in my scene and try to make an exposure keeping those factors in mind. Once again, I must stress this is based on my own testing only. After I made my tests I realized that my particular lens for the test had a slow shutter, but I also forgot to account for light fall-off from vignetting (which actually basically cancelled each other out and have proven to still be good guidelines for me, and have since been reinforced with many more exposures).

As for rating the film speed, I treated it as ASA50 and just stick with that. Others shoot at ASA40, others at 60. I don't think it really matters what you call it if you've done your own testing as long as you're consistent. I could rate it at ASA40 as well, but then I'd shift my own guidelines down 1/3 of a stop to compensate - I see it as semantics. With B&W film and the Zone system there's a well defined meaning for Zones and testing to determine your film speed is part of that - I just don't think of slide film the same way.

As for how exactly I would have metered those scenes, as others have said I probably would have just made different photographs altogether. For the scenes, such as they are, I think you exposed them as well as one could, it's just that it's tough to produce a pleasing exposure when lots of highlight detail and lots of shadow detail. If you were to isolate a part of the scene in consistent light that might work better with Velvia. For example, a tighter crop of the shoreline in the first exposure, eliminating the sky altogether, might even allow you to give it a little more exposure (because you wouldn't be worried about the sky) which could add a little more detail to the shadows.

Bottom line advice, hold off on using Velvia when the contrast is really harsh and save it for scenes with more consistent light (which just happens to coincide with overcast days, which is why it's a consistent suggestion for when Velvia really works, but not to the exclusion of all other scenarios, as DanielStone deftly demonstrates above).

Regarding filters:
81A - Essentially a warming filter. This won't help with exposure issues, but on those overcast days, or when shooting in shadows it can help to 'warm' up the tones so that it doesn't look like you're shooting on an overcast day, or in the shadows.

CPL - In some situations, it can darken the sky without affecting much else in a scene, which can obviously help bring the value of the sky in line with the rest of a scene. It also cuts out some reflected light (off of glass, rock, or foliage etc). It's actually surprisingly effective on foliage actually (I tend to forget this) - if you're photographing green leaves / trees etc in direct sun a lot of color is actually washed out from reflection - try out the CPL and it can be surprising how much more the color will pop. A CPL is somewhat effective in reducing distant-haze.

ND Grad - Darkens only a portion of a scene. A hard-edged ND Grad filter placed to align with a horizon, as a common example, can darken a sky and everything above the horizon helping to make an exposure more manageable by taming the dynamic range (Giovanni's example is an excellent creative use of ND filters on something other than a horizon).

/YMMV
/Test, test, test, or at least take lots of notes while you get acquainted
/writing a lot doesn't make what I have to say any more valid than anyone else's advice. I'm always learning too.

[Collas]

Is there much of a difference in a CPL (I'm assuming it's a Circular Polarizing Filter) and a Linear Polarizing filter? I've got both - circulars for the 35mm cameras, and a recent purchase, at a good price, of a Lee 100mm square glass linear.

I've always gone for circulars due to their alleged problems with metering systems in 35mm cameras, but I've tried the linear on my Contax AX and the metering and autofocus still work. Is this just a fluke, or would other manufacturer's cameras have a genuine difficulty with a linear?

Nick

[Daniel Stone]

just a problem with digital cameras, and newer versions of film cameras that used RGB sensors for metering and AF operation

I use a CPL for film and it works just the same way as my linear polarizer

-Dan

[Ivan J. Eberle]

Linear polarizers are a lot less expensive if you're only using a particular size for LF. I don't have any 67mm lenses that require circular ones, for instance.