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Thread: is all photography documentary?

  1. #11

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    is all photography documentary?

    In looking at the discussion between Paul and Ellis, I would also have to agree that true documentation cannot interpret. Doing so would only "taint" the image with subjective qualities.

    I remember a photography student at the university who tried to deal with such issues in his work. In trying to use the camera as a "tool to document", he had set up a system for determining what location to photograph, when to photograph and which direction to photograph. The determining factor to photograph a location was made by a small piece of paper that was dropped from standing height and would randomly flake down onto a large gridded city-map on the floor. Where the paper fell determined the coordinates where he would photograph next. Using his city as his subject, he would always photograph at the same time of day, using the same camera, same tripod height, same film, and at first, with the same exposure. His system was quite complex, standardizing the entire procedure and after a series of hundreds of 16x20 prints, it was quite interesting to see what had been captured by his camera. Sometimes things where totally out of frame, with cars or people moving into or out of the image.

    Initially, he had standardized the exposure to only one setting, but after a series of shots, it became evident that innappropriate exposures began to interfere with the project.

    Although he couldn't eliminate all the decision making processes, as the system itself was a decision, he had brought photography to the most objective level he could think of, removing most of the subjective aesthetic choices in everday photography. Interesting.

  2. #12
    multiplex
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    is all photography documentary?

    so if i am understanding you correctly, the only way to have a "true" documentary photograph would be to automate the whole process. to take all the thinking and thought processes out of the whole image making process ... and as soon as an agenda is afixed to a photograph or series of images, it becomes propaganda of one sort or another. is the only way to make documentary images by printing film from a surveilence camera?

    i had been under the impression that a visual record of time and place was the same thing as a documentary photograph and that document and record were pretty much the same thing.

  3. #13
    multiplex
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    is all photography documentary?

    i realize now after i submitted my last message that even if one printed film from a survelience camera there would be some thinking - editing, framing &c involved. i guess it would have to be printed by a robot or automated mini-lab or something ..

  4. #14

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    is all photography documentary?

    To answer your original question John: Yes all photography is documentary photography but even in a completely random system there is still an author or curatorial voice, and that voice belongs to the viewer who structures according to his or her own experience of the image(s), experiences and prejudices.,P>In this discussion I fear we have gone into the stage where the discussion has degenerated to mere rhetorical dogs chasing sophilistic cats. Go out and start making pictures for a month and then let's resume the discussions.

  5. #15

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    is all photography documentary?

    ...John, sure these discussions are rhetoric, however, I feel such discussions help to shift perspectives slightly...enough to allow you to think about photography in a different way

  6. #16
    tim atherton's Avatar
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    is all photography documentary?

    read Doing Documentary Work by Robert Coles.

    ...."Robert Coles, a child psychiatrist whose series of books on children won him a Pulitzer Prize, has turned his watchful eye to the nature of the documentary and produced a thought-provoking book. In somewhat the manner of James Faris's recent study, Navajo and Photography, Coles reveals how documentarians like Dorothea Lange and Walker Evans edited and cropped their images to produce a desired effect, and raises the question of authenticity versus manipulation. Lange, the subject of a previous biographical study by Coles, comes under close scrutiny as he contrasts her iconic image of a migrant mother with obscure photographs shot moments earlier. The author also recalls James Agee's self-critical appraisal of his and Evans's "insensitivity" and "arrogance" in pursuing an editorial assignment....."
    You'd be amazed how small the demand is for pictures of trees... - Fred Astaire to Audrey Hepburn

    www.photo-muse.blogspot.com blog

  7. #17

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    is all photography documentary?

    yes and so what? Just because a photographer doesn't portray the subject in a way that the subject is comfortable with doesn't mean the work produced is false. Irember the old saying "a photograph never lies" well there is a corollary "..but photographers do all the time." All you can do as someone who makes "documentary phootgraphs" is honor your own sense of what is true to the people or to the issue you are photographing. just remember no single set of photographs can ever contain the entire truth about anything. "Hamlet" is true even though it is a fiction. Richard Avedon considers all of his portraits to be "fictions." My feeling is that 'truth" itself is a lie we create to make sense of the world and it is a well known philosophical concept that perhaps the physical world itself is a mere shadow of the real (AKA "plato's cave").

  8. #18

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    is all photography documentary?

    yes and so what? Just because a photographer doesn't portray the subject in a way that the subject is comfortable with doesn't mean the work produced is false. Irember the old saying "a photograph never lies" well there is a corollary "..but photographers do all the time." All you can do as someone who makes "documentary phootgraphs" is honor your own sense of what is true to the people or to the issue you are photographing. just remember no single set of photographs can ever contain the entire truth about anything. "Hamlet" is true even though it is a fiction. Richard Avedon considers all of his portraits to be "fictions." My feeling is that 'truth" itself is a lie we create to make sense of the world and it is a well known philosophical concept that perhaps the physical world itself is a mere shadow of the real (AKA "plato's cave").

    I have to go now. there are more tales to tell. And photography is a story teller's medium.

  9. #19

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    is all photography documentary?

    After having followed several rather philosophical threads, I dare to come with my question that has been haunting me since a long time: Why are we so concerned, if not obsessed by a perfect sharpness of our photographs?

  10. #20

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    is all photography documentary?

    OOps!!!, I pressed a wrong button to launch the thread. Sorry for that! Please diregard this question here.

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