How do you use front asymmetric movements?

[Peter De Smidt]

My Sinar P brochure says:

"For sharpness control with lens tilt (where the perspective must remain constant) the tilt angles obtained are simply read off on the image standard, and the latter returned to it's starting position. These tilt values are transferred to the lens standard, turning in the same direction. Refocus for overall sharpness and make any final precision adjustments on the image standard. That is all."

Elsewhere on that page, they say:

"The swing and tilt axes of the lens standard also have a common plane. This greatly reduces refocusing with the lens tilts and swings (here not completely avoidable)."

I think the issue is that when you tilt the front the image framing changes, as you're pointing the cone of illumination of the lens in a slightly different direction, whereas this does not happen with rear tilts, which is why greater lens coverage is needed for lens tilts than rear tilts. As the image moves on the ground glass, the part that falls on the focusing line will change. That's why using asymmetric tilts on the front standard takes a little more work than on the back.

[Ed Richards]

Thanks urs0polar!! Better than answering my question about P/X, I now understand how my F2 is meant to work!!

[Peter De Smidt]

My first LF camera was a Sinar P. The various depth of field scales and asymmetric tilts helped me learn how to use a view camera. They would be less helpful for a seasoned LF shooter. There's a lot more LF how-to resources now, such as this site, than there were when I started out.

[Frank Petronio]

Thank goodness I never had to learn this stuff!

[Leigh]

Thank goodness I never had to learn this stuff!

Frank, your models are seldom asymmetrical.

Of course, that's not a bad thing.

- Leigh

[Joanna Carter]

'… These movements are then transferred to the lens standard, remembering that they must be reversed, i.e. in the opposite direction of the movements on the rear standard. After the movements have been transferred to the front standard, reset the rear standard to its detent (zero) position and refocus'

… not forgetting that the hinge point will have been thrown forwards due to the back tilt, therefore, the plane of sharp focus will not be at the same angle to the vertical back that it was set up to be when the back was tilted.

No, John, you have quoted the best bit of advice:

'When perspective control is important, then swings and tilts are best employed at the lens plane… '

Would somebody please give a solid reason (apart from allegedly being quicker) why anyone would need asymmetric tilts?

And what if you need to place the plane of sharp focus where there is nothing on the asymmetric line?

… Muttering darkly, Joanna goes to make a cup of coffee…

[Leigh]

I looked at the PDF on the Ebony site regarding their implementation of this feature.

I didn't see any examples in that document that couldn't be done with traditional movements.

Maybe I'm missing something.

- Leigh

[Joanna Carter]

Thank goodness I never had to learn this stuff!

Amen to that brother

I was so fortunate when I bought my first Ebony. I thought I should go for the "ultimate" SV45U2, which has asymmetric movements, but, since my pocket wasn't that deep and, since I happened on a secondhand SV45Te for around £1200, I find myself in same position as you Frank, not having to learn, or even care, about asymmetric movements

I looked at the PDF on the Ebony site regarding their implementation of this feature.

I didn't see any examples in that document that couldn't be done with traditional movements.

Maybe I'm missing something.

Yes, you are missing that feeling that you have spent more money than you needed to

[Brian Ellis]

Amen to that brother

I was so fortunate when I bought my first Ebony. I thought I should go for the "ultimate" SV45U2, which has asymmetric movements, but, since my pocket wasn't that deep and, since I happened on a secondhand SV45Te for around £1200, I find myself in same position as you Frank, not having to learn, or even care, about asymmetric movements


Yes, you are missing that feeling that you have spent more money than you needed to

Having bought a couple Ebony cameras without asymetric tilt after spending a lot of time thinking about buying one with it, I'm not aware of any claims by its advocates or by Ebony that it allows you to do anything you couldn't do without it.It's a matter of speed and convenience. However, it's like many camera features - quicker and easier is nothing to sneeze at and they're worth something to many people.

[John Hoang]

Joanna Carter
Quote:
And what if you need to place the plane of sharp focus where there is nothing on the asymmetric line?

Large format users usually apply different movements for different scenes. We do not use tilt, or shift, or swing... all the time. In your case, just do not use it!

Brian Ellis
Quote:
However, it's like many camera features - quicker and easier is nothing to sneeze at and they're worth something to many people.

Agree!