LF hikers ― is “Map & Compass” a dying art?

[r.e.]

But I do recognize my own mortality and carry a SPOT personal locator just in case I find myself unexpectedly in a unrecoverable position by myself.

Finally someone surfaces who knows what's going on with the technology and its value.

[Drew Wiley]

GPS can be downright dangerous if a person doesn't recognize its limitations. At the simplest level they merely recognize latitude/longitude and you need an accompanying map
to make sense of them. But what most people are buying have some sort of crude on-board topo map system too. And I emphasize crude. It won't show enough detail to allow
safe planning. Reminds me of the time a Boy Scout troop leader looked at a Forest Service
map and figured it was just a four mile hike from point A to B. Problem was, there was a
7000 ft deep canyon in the middle and eight of them died. Don't tell me people aren't that
stupid. I've seen my share of body bags atop mule trains.

[Greg Miller]

Where did I say people aren't that stupid? I said most people aren't that stupid. Using your logic people should not be driving cars either, rather driving mule trains. And to echo R.E.'s points your logic is also based on people only have GPS to the exclusion of all else. All-in-all a rather shallow and extreme position from which to build a sound argument.

Can a GPS be dangerous? I guess, yes, in the same sense that a fork can be dangerous. But it would be silly to argue against using a fork at the expensive of the benefits that a fork can provide.

[Drew Wiley]

GPS in the commercialized sense is now largely a navigation aid. They subscribe to maps
others have made. Did you know that every commercial map out there has deliberate flaws
somewhere on it just so they can catch someone pilfering their own work? These put those
flaws where they think it's harmless. And there are no instant updates, like the fact that
Forest Service gates get locked at a certain point. There have been horrific tragedies in
recent years do to this. This is a techie gadget era. People blindly rely on these things.
And both hikers and drivers have gotten killed due to the false confidence they inspire.
Correctly used, they can certainly supplement other means of navigation or assist in rescues. But honestly, how did people get around for the last hundred thousand years?
People died outdoors then. People still die now, gadgety or not. Go into the local REI
superstore and they sell twenty flavors of GPS but not a single decent pair of hiking boots. Two inches of snow on the ground and you're frostbitten.

[Leonard Metcalf]

I used to teach navigation and bushwalking (hiking) for a living. I wouldn't recommend relying on a GPS, and tell people that they need to be able to read and use a map and compass.

So yes I can use one, and there is a lot of potential for things to go wrong, when the battery goes flat, or the thing stops working...

[djhopscotch]

Go into the local REI
superstore and they sell twenty flavors of GPS but not a single decent pair of hiking boots. Two inches of snow on the ground and you're frostbitten.

FYI REIs don't carry the full line of snow boots in the warmer months, since the warmer months don't get much snow. You can get many decent pairs of hiking boots for any level of exposure at rei, you just have to look during the right season. Out of season they will order you a pair and ship to the store at no cost. I'll get off your lawn now.

[Greg Miller]

GPS in the commercialized sense is now largely a navigation aid. They subscribe to maps
others have made. Did you know that every commercial map out there has deliberate flaws
somewhere on it just so they can catch someone pilfering their own work? These put those
flaws where they think it's harmless. And there are no instant updates, like the fact that
Forest Service gates get locked at a certain point. There have been horrific tragedies in
recent years do to this. This is a techie gadget era. People blindly rely on these things.
And both hikers and drivers have gotten killed due to the false confidence they inspire.
Correctly used, they can certainly supplement other means of navigation or assist in rescues. But honestly, how did people get around for the last hundred thousand years?
People died outdoors then. People still die now, gadgety or not. Go into the local REI
superstore and they sell twenty flavors of GPS but not a single decent pair of hiking boots. Two inches of snow on the ground and you're frostbitten.

There you go again. A few stupid people die from blindly relying on a GPS, and therefore nobody should use a GPS.

I use my car GPS to get around the roads of New Jersey.
And I have used my boots purchased at Campmor to summit mountains in -30 degree temps.
I guess I should be thankful for the miracle that I am still alive and have all 10 toes.
And none of us should use car batteries because some people hook up the jumper cables wrong and the battery explodes in their face.

BTW, those 2" of snow help insulate the feet and keep them near 32 degrees, making it much less likely to get frostbite than if there was no snow on the ground.

[bobwysiwyg]

Drew, can you support this claim?

Did you know that every commercial map out there has deliberate flaws somewhere on it just so they can catch someone pilfering theirownwork?

[John Kasaian]

LORAN, Anyone?

[Steve Smith]

Drew, can you support this claim?

http://www.bl.uk/onlinegallery/featu...nd/m3-3-1.html


Steve.