Graflex Crown Graphic - downsides for newbie?

[Robbie Shymanski]

The Crown is a great starter for LF. It is one of those cameras that all have some experience with, love or hate. They are great for beginners because they teach you very well on what you want/need in a LF camera. Personally, I have found using them to be limited due to the awkwardness of no rotating back. I like vertical shots. But it is a great backpacker. An SA 90, a bag full of holders (a couple Grafmatic backs), a Tilitall, and you are off shooting. That may be all you'll ever need.
No has really mentioned the other plus of a Crown is a Graflock back! Personally, I wouldn't use a 4x5 without one. But then I am going through a phase of discovering the potential of all the nifty roll and instant backs that make use of the Graflock.

[Ivan J. Eberle]

The only thing I can think of that a Crown does better than a Super Graphic is use very wide angles with rack focusing. For normal-ish lenses, the SG is better in most every way. Though I will admit a Crown is more aesthetically pleasing.

[Frank Petronio]

The latest Crown I've been using has been stripped of the RF and VF and even the strap. It makes shooting verticals easier not to fiddle with the strap. It packs easier too.

I'm all for shooting large-format handheld if you shoot f/16 with a handle mount flash... but I like shooting portrait distances with a wide-open lens and the rangefinder simply isn't designed to do that so I chucked it.

[Bob Kerner]

Dan, did we answer your question?

As you can see, there are many passionate views on where to start. I just ant to make sure we actually answered your question.

[aduncanson]

two cents.........I see the Graphics as an oversize 35mm camera. Back & lens are frequently parallel but, you get a big negative.

For landscapes without movements a Mamiya 7 is just as good. Better lenses than most you see on the Graphic, but smaller neg.

Monorail probably give the most bang for the buck as long as you don't want to "run and gun"

This is a more concise expression of what I have been wanting to say.

To me, a hand held 4x5 provides no more image quality than a good MF camera hand held.

If you buy an inexpensive, expandable monorail like a Cambo, a Toyo, certain Omegas, a Horseman, or perhaps better, a Sinar F; along with a capable lens like a convertible Symmar or a longer tessar, it will make all movements readily available. And if studio or architecture photography is not your primary bag, it could be the only monorail camera you ever need.

[Frank Petronio]

A good medium format negative, not 6x4.5, but from a top-tier camera like a Mamiya 7, a Fuji GW690 or GSW690... can look pretty great. I used to use a Fuji 6x9 and have a ISO 100 6x9 neg that passes for ISO 400 4x5 in a 16x20 wet print, pretty amazing.

BUT if you have a digital workflow, scanning that 6x9 well is a lot harder than scanning a 4x5. And even an average mediocre 4x5 scan will outperform all but the best scans of a 6x9.

I wouldn't really compared the two unless I had at least an Imacon or Coolscan 9000 to scan the 6x9 with. Scan 6x9 and 4x5 on your Epson flatbed and you'll get a 6x9 file that is pretty much HALF as good as the 4x5 ;-)

If you're critical, 4x5 is actually cheaper and easier than 6x9 in terms of making nice, large prints.

[aduncanson]

I would not disagree with any of that Frank.

[Jim Graves]

A Crown Graphic is the PERFECT way to start when you're on a budget.

[Frank Bunnik]

Forward tilt without the awkward way of first putting the front lid of the camera in the down position, then tilting the lens all the way back and then sliding the front standard back on the rail (and probably also adding some rise), then focussing and aplying forward tilt can easily be achieved on a Crown.

What you do is you unscrew the 2 knobs that lock rise on the lens standard. When these are removed, you can slide the lens standard out of the U shaped front standard. You then slide the front standard off the rails, turn it around, turn the locking knob of the front standard (which is now facing backwards) back to the front again, slide the front standard back on the rails and the slide the lens standard back into the U shaped front standard. Screw the 2 rise knobs back on and now you have forward tilt as a standard (of course you no longer have any backward tilt but most of the times forward tilt is what you need).

When you have the rangefinder on the camera and use the rangefinder, you have to remove (by unscrewing it) the knob on the left side of the front standard (as seen from the front) that locks the tilt since this will interfere with the knob of the rangefinder mounted on the focussing rail (maybe only if you have a side mounted rangefinder). This is no problem since there is a second locking knob on the right side of the frontstandard and as long as you don't use very heavy lenses (a 5,6 210mm in a Copal 1 is no problem at all).

This is a simple 5 minute job for which you need minimal tools (pliers are all you will need).

What you need to understand is that the Crown was never built as a field camera. It was a press camera and people now use it as a field camera. For that purpose it has limitations. Used in vertical mode by turning it on it's side, you have no tilt at all. However, it is a very cheap 4x5 camera of excellent quality. It can focus a 65mm super wide angle on a standard flat lens board. It is light and makes a good backpacking camera. You are not limited to lenses of the 1950's and 60's since you can mount most modern lenses as long as you have a lens panel with the right shuttersize. Focus on the groundglass.

If you can live with it's limitations, you can get yourself an excellent 4x5 camera set with modern lenses for much less money then what an Ebony camera body will cost you. If after some time of using the camera you would want a camera with more movements than the Crown, you sell the camera with little or no loss and you can use your lenses on any other 4x5 camera, just change the lensboards.

[JamesFromSydney]

I've experienced vastly better tonal graduation, resolution and overall feel with hand-held 4x5 than with medium format.

Have folk who are saying there's no difference actually tried it, or is this just forum talk?

Frank is right, although I have used the RF for successful hand-held portraits, including indoors with natural window light. Try HP5 pushed to 1600 at f/8, 125s with a ~135mm lens. At 10 feet, you get more than a foot each side of the subject of acceptable focus. You will get much better results on a tripod, but it does work hand-held, which is what these cameras were designed for, of course.

Then there's the cost. A Mamiya 7 is certainly a nice camera, but it will be a multiple of the cost of the Crown, and I'd guess more likely to fall apart. My CG is 60 years old and will likely outlive me. I've heard of people not being able to get Mamiya 6's fixed at all, due to lack of parts and shoddy construction. Also, anything with electronics will definitely fail eventually, possibly with no fix.

Scanning MF really sucks unless you have an Imacon, whereas 4x5 scans beautifully on a consumer flatbed.

I've had a wooden folder 4x5, which was very nice, but I did not need all the movements and it was a pain to setup. The CG just goes in my normal backpack & pops open ready to shoot (no attaching lenses, assembling the font standard etc.). It's not any more trouble than my Hasselblad. You don't need a darkcloth -- just use the viewing hood.

I can't think of any downsides, really, unless you want to use barrel lenses.