Asymmetrical Movements - Pro & Con

[Greg Liscio]

Opinions please on the value (or not) of asymmetrical tilt movements, especially when compared to a base/center tilt combination. Also asymmetrical swing compared to standard swing.

Thank you.

[Joanna Carter]

Opinions please on the value (or not) of asymmetrical tilt movements, especially when compared to a base/center tilt combination. Also asymmetrical swing compared to standard swing.

I, personally, cannot see any advantage in asymmetric tilts, apart from a slight time-saving when photographing non-architectural subjects. Also being able to use asymmetric movements really depends on whether or not you have anything in your plane of focus that falls easily on the asymmetric line.

I have an Ebony SV45Te which has both axis and base tilts and I find that I can focus most scenes in less than 30 seconds. I would only ever use back movements in very rare circumstances and usually use front axis tilt for the majority of images that require any tilt.

I suppose, if you have to have asymmetric movements, then swing is more useful than tilt but, since I rarely need to use swing, it doesn't really concern me.

[Frank Petronio]

I don't get it either, unless I did studio shots of multiple wine bottles from a high vantage point I have a hard time coming up with situations where they would make a difference? Or at least so far, I've only been shooting large format 25 years, I'm a newb.

If I was buying a luxury camera I'd go for the Arca's micro-metrix orbitz stuff, those little geared movements seem a lot more useful.

[Leonard Evens]

I agree that an asymmetric tilt is only helpful if there is something of interest on the line that stays fixed. My Toho FC-45X has only base tilt but has axial swing. In either case, I use the near far method to set the plane of exact focus. I make an initial guess, usually about 5 degrees. I choose two points, a near point and far point I want in that plane, focus on the far point and then focus on the near point. If I have to increase the distance between the standards in doing so, I increase the tilt (swing) and if I have to decrease the distance between the standards, I decrease the tilt (swing). Usually at most three iterations of this procedure result in both points being simultaneously in focus, and this usually takes between 30 seconds and one minute.

[Steve Hamley]

I'll offer the "dissenting opinion". I like and use the asymmetric rear movements on the Ebony field cameras and IMO they're quite useful.

Richard Sexton has a nice article on asymmetric movements on the Ebony website:

http://www.ebonycamera.com/cam.html

I've found asymmetric movements most useful when setting up a near-far shot in rapidly changing light when seconds can matter - most of us know that "prime time" during a sunset or sunrise can literally be a minute or less. Usually the quick two-step process is all I need: focus on the swing/tilt line, then swing or tilt the rest of the composition into focus.

Whether they're worth what Ebony charges for them is up to you. You can of course set the back at the exact same angle regardless of whether the movements are asymmetric or symmetric. I think they are but there are others that don't. And obviously (as far as the Ebonys go) if you don't use rear movements a lot then paying extra for a rarely used feature is questionable.

And Sinar apparently think asymmetric movements are a good thing as do may Sinar users.

Cheers, Steve

[Emmanuel BIGLER]

Hello from the Old World

I remember that a very similar issue was raised on the UK Large Format Forum. I shall not disclose who started the subject ;-)
The discussion, besides the question of asymmetric movements, raised some interesting (IMHO) remarks & developments.
http://www.lf-photo.org.uk/forum/vie...ght=asymmetric

sotto voce : I'll never be allowed to disclose here the meaning of "Pro & Con" in the French Photographic community ;-)

[timparkin]

I'll offer the "dissenting opinion". I like and use the asymmetric rear movements on the Ebony field cameras and IMO they're quite useful.

Richard Sexton has a nice article on asymmetric movements on the Ebony website:

http://www.ebonycamera.com/cam.html

I've found asymmetric movements most useful when setting up a near-far shot in rapidly changing light when seconds can matter - most of us know that "prime time" during a sunset or sunrise can literally be a minute or less. Usually the quick two-step process is all I need: focus on the swing/tilt line, then swing or tilt the rest of the composition into focus.

Whether they're worth what Ebony charges for them is up to you. You can of course set the back at the exact same angle regardless of whether the movements are asymmetric or symmetric. I think they are but there are others that don't. And obviously (as far as the Ebonys go) if you don't use rear movements a lot then paying extra for a rarely used feature is questionable.

And Sinar apparently think asymmetric movements are a good thing as do may Sinar users.

Cheers, Steve

Another vote for assymetric tilt. As far as I am concerned it reduces the number of iterations to one is so many cases as to be a useful feature. Yes it doesn't work quite so well in conditions where you don't have a feature you want in focus on the pivot line so it becomes 'as good as' centre/base tilt at that point. I would say about 6/10 shots let me use the assymetric tilt so 60% of the time I'm quicker using it than I would be without it.

Would I sacrifice it? Only to reduce weight.. If I were after a lightweight kit I would buy an Ebony 45S with only centre tilt and no swing on the back standard.

Tim

[joolsb]

I wonder if the naysayers are simply jealous?

Anyway, I bought my 45SU after seeing Joe Cornish demonstrate the advantage of asymmetric tilts on a workshop. He calls it 'the nearest thing to autofocus for view cameras' and he's not wrong. There have not been many occasions when I haven't been able to use it. In fact, it makes life so easy that there's a danger of using it all the time - even when front-tilt would be preferable.

[Emmanuel BIGLER]

the naysayers

As a non-native English speaker, one of the best reference I know about "naysayers" is a quotation credited to the famous physicist C.H. Townes, co-inventor of the laser :

Nothing stops "naysayers" like a working device

W. E. Lamb, W. P. Schleich, M. O. Scully, C. H. Townes, "Laser physics: Quantum controversy in action", Rev. Mod. Phys. 71, S263-S273 (1999)
http://prola.aps.org/abstract/RMP/v71/i2/pS263_1

[Dave Jeffery]

"I would say about 6/10 shots let me use the assymetric tilt so 60% of the time I'm quicker using it than I would be without it."

Ditto I like having the option of focusing in two steps.