Looking for a new camera: Shen-Hao vs Chamonix

[thechrisproject]

Hello, all. I've been recommended this forum from the flickr large format group.

I'm looking to buy my first 4x5 soon. I've been doing lots of research, asking a lot of people questions, and learning as much as possible. I shoot landscapes... often in parking garages. Examples.

On a 35mm camera, I use 24mm and 35mm lenses predominantly. I've used Tilt/Shift lenses and borrowed a monorail 4x5 and found that being able to move the front standard up is the vitally important movement for me. Having a foldable camera is also important. The monorail I borrowed was a hassle to walk around with.

So I've kind of narrowed things down to a new Shen-Hao or a Chamonix. I can get a Shen-Hao from Badger, which appeals to me because I live in Wisconsin. And somebody on ebay has a number of Chamonix in stock, so I wouldn't have to wait 6 months. If I did, I'd go with the Shen-Hao. I'd like to spend less than $1000. I'm open to other suggestions. I might start with a lens in the 105-135 range, but I don't forsee using anything much longer than 150. I might want to use a 65 or a 90 later.

It's been hard to figure out the movements based on specs. Sometimes the front rise and fall are expressed as one number, which doesn't seem to tell me exactly how much rise I can get. Although I guess the image circle of the lens limits that as well. Stats on image circle size aren't the easiest for me to find either. Do you find that 90-135mm lenses often have image circles that limit movements more so than the camera itself? Which camera would you get in my position?

Thanks, and if I forgot any relevant info, lemme know. Sorry if you get posts like this all the time. I see them in other camera groups and groan at them sometimes.

[Turner Reich]

The Shen Hao is a nice camera and Badger is an excellent dealer, hands down. I can't think of any down sides to the Shen Hao except for the bellow extension which could be longer but for a camera of this type it's a small to non concern. The lenses you are going to use would be perfect for this camera and the price is a winner too. I'd go with it, I did as did thousands of others. It has an international Graflok back too. Everything works smooth and it's not that heavy either. Good luck.

[thechrisproject]

Good to know Badger is a good dealer. That makes a difference. At this time I have no plans to use long focal lengths or shoot anything closer than 5 feet away, so I'm not sure limited bellows extension will matter. Yes?

[Michael Gordon]

Both cameras are very capable of generous movements all the way around. The most significant differences between the cameras is in handling. The Shen-Hao is a little more precise (like perhaps the Ebony's that it copies), while the Chamonix has little to no gearing or detents. I prefer the Chamonix's freer and faster controls and more 'intuitive' movements. Both are excellent cameras for money. Have a ball.

[venchka]

Looking at your work I would describe your work as architectural interiors. That doesn't change your camera & lens choices. The Large Format Information page has numerous articles and tables showing image circle. Buy all you can get. You may also find a bag bellows to be a good accessory. The Chamonix Universal Bellows is a good option. In 35mm film terms, a 125mm lens on 4x5 is roughly equal to a 35mm lens on the smaller film. A 90mm lens = 28mm, approximately.

http://www.largeformatphotography.in...s/LF4x5in.html

Add Midwest Photo Exchange and KEH to your shopping list.

Good luck!

[Sheldon N]

The Chamonix would be 1.5-2 lbs lighter, if that matters to you.

To me the most important figure would be the amount of front rise available with the standard bellows on a 90mm focal length lens. Typically this is the challenge for field cameras, since it is the most commonly used movement on the most common lens. A 135mm lens typically will have less image circle than a 90mm lens, since the average 135mm lens is a plasmat design (200-210mm image circle) and the average 90mm lens is a wide angle (wasp waist) design (215-230mm image circle).

I don't have either camera so now would be the time for owners to chime in, but from what I remember the Chamonix does better on movements with wide angle lenses on the stock bellows. If you go to the bag bellows, then this becomes a non-issue.

[Brian Ellis]

I've owned both, I'd get the Chamonix and it would be an easy decision. It's about 2 pounds lighter than the Shen, has axis front tilt (axis on the Shen can be done but it's kind of a pain), a considerably longer bellows (about 15" vs 12") (again, the Shen can go to about 14" but you have to use base tilt to extend the lens out in front of the camera bed to do it and then use axis tilt to bring the lens parallel with the film, an awkward procedure at least for me), and just in general the Chamonix is a more elegant, nicer camera IMHO. It probably costs roughly $200 more now than the Shen but is well worth it IMHO.

[venchka]

Read this...

http://www.largeformatphotography.in...ad.php?t=46921

Do some searching on this forum for info. on both cameras.

[Gem Singer]

Badger shows the new Shen Hao PTB on their website. This camera is a light weight 4X5 copy of the Chamonix (which is a copy of the Phillips). It appears to be in stock, and is priced very reasonably at $650.

I've only seen pictures of the PTB, but it looks like a nice camera. Probably not built as well as the Chamonix, but it is immediately available and is priced right.

Check it out.

[Peter De Smidt]

Shen Hao makes three 4x5 cameras:
The PTB,
HZX-45-IIA,
TZ45-IIB

Just from looking at web images, the TZ45-IIB interests me the most. Unfortunately, Badger is out of stock at the moment, but they should have more in soon. When they do, I'll stop by and check them out. Badger is definitely worth a visit, if nothing else to see some John Sexton prints. It's not a standard retail store, and so don't expect that. It's more like an office, workroom and warehouse. If you stop by, it's right off of hwy 41 in Kaukauna, make sure to check out their hours, and make sure Jeff will be there.

I've briefly handled the PTB. It looks like a nice camera. I used to own a Chamonix, and I don't see any reason to prefer it over the Shen-Hao.