Wild Idea for Next-Gen LF

[aphexafx]

I was a student 10 years ago, and I try to always think of myself as a student. That's what keeps the work inventive...

Thanks for the kind words, and your attitude is inspiring. I very much dig your work as well, especially your experimental stuff. Absolutley fantstic. Never quit experimenting and never quit learning!

Cheers.

[aphexafx]

Some people are good with computers and some are better suited for shovels. There is a perfect tool for everybody out there.

P.S.
As the irony would have it, reading about the more recent of these two accidents, it appears that the computer was functioning flawlessly but was being fed erroneous data by a faulty altimeter (usually an analog instrument).

[G Benaim]

I'm not sure what one gains over a ground glass, other than right-side-up viewing (and that one is debatable). Can someone explain the advantages?

[aphexafx]

I'm not sure what one gains over a ground glass, other than right-side-up viewing (and that one is debatable). Can someone explain the advantages?

The idea is for a lightweight interactive digital proofing system for LF cameras that would replace a standard GG/back.

Exposure calculation (with visual verification) on a backlit LCD would, for one thing, equalize things like low light and allow you to better visualize what you are attempting to photograph, especially in conditions that make GG hard to use. Even very dim scenes could be sampled for a short duration in order to render an image for easy analysis.

Contrast/edge detection could help you define focus. Film simulation could help you preview what the scene will look like on film for any given exposure with a histogram and highlight/shadow warnings tuned to your film to boot. Parallel edges and alignment could be verified computationally, etc.

Example: You might specify (pen, tap, etc.) two or more points that you wish to be in focus and stop your lens down to your working aperture and let the device accumulate an exposure (or a shorter rough equivlent). You could then verify your DOF visually or automatically using edge detection, etc.

It could even use "onion skinning" and allow you to see changes to your view as compared to another: perfectly align scene elements during special effect multi-exposures with complex masking and lighting. Preview soft-focus and diffraction effects. Make sure your working aperture is not rendering your diffraction screen in a distracting manner. Make sure your ND grad is rendered well at your working aperture.

Basically a big digital live "Polaroid" (with perks) to experiment with, free of charge and delay, in order to define your exposure, which would then be made to film in the traditional manner.

I am all for tradition and good old skill, but in a studio this type of device would be absolutely fantastic for product and other commercial type work where technical specifics are mandatory and time is valuable.

For field/location work, add GPS and a digital level to record location notes and camera position for later compositing. Hell, add a pen interface and take notes right on your screen. It is a great concept.

[Vaughn]

Some people are good with computers and some are better suited for shovels. There is a perfect tool for everybody out there.

I guess the next time I need to dig a hole, I'll try to use my keyboard.

It is an interesting idea, not a significant advantage over a gg for landscape work, except for a very small percentage of circumstances...composing and focusing in very low light being the major one. Checking depth of field at very small f stops that are usually too dark to see anything on the gg even in good light is another advantage.

But I can see it would be a big hit for those who love computer gadgetry and also have deep pockets. Personally, I never saw a lot of need to proof with Polaroids, nor with digital cameras, so I see this idea as sort of like the idea of having one's car talk to you...I'd rather not have my car tell me what to do...the beeping is bad enough.

Vaughn

[Marko]

I guess the next time I need to dig a hole, I'll try to use my keyboard.

I don't know, as a keyboard person myself, I am not sure how efficient that would be. When it comes to digging holes, I prefer to hire one of the shovel experts. They are much more proficient at it than I am, not to mention cheaper...

I'd rather not have my car tell me what to do...

Yeah, real men have wives for that.

[GPS]

...

The thing is, you don't know if the idea is or could potentially be feasible unless and until you try it. My point is that coming up with an idea takes a very different skill set than making an idea work.


...

You speak as somebody who has not the faintest idea about any scientific work and engineering, indeed.
It is before you try an idea that you scrutinize it in the light of the scientific knowledge and its feasibility. Only when you come to the conclusion that the idea is feasible, you try it. Or you think that people sent up there the ISS for billions of $ just to "try it"? Without knowing if it is feasible or not? You take engineers for fools. You have no idea about what you say

And to make an idea work you have to have a plenty of your own ideas on how to make it work. Without it you cannot invent anything. Ask engineers...
But of course, you know engineers who can make work just any idea without being able to dream up anything on their own... A strange species, those...

[Marko]

You speak as somebody who has not the faintest idea about any scientific work and engineering, indeed.

It is before you try an idea that you scrutinize it in the light of the scientific knowledge and its feasibility. Only when you come to the conclusion that the idea is feasible, you try it. Or you think that people sent up there the ISS for billions of $ just to "try it"? Without knowing if it is feasible or not? You have no idea about what you say

So all those catastrophes and failed launches and lost satellites, and the initial focusing system failure on the Hubble and so many other mishaps including the very recent satellite collision were all a result of a calculated decision stemming from someone's careful and deliberate brainstorming session where they chose just the right idea among so many? Yeah, space is a big place, losing a satellite is easy enough, but colliding the two of them really takes some effort, eh?

Please, tell me some more about how science and engineering really work. This is getting better than Jay Leno...

P.S. A science degree and a few years of architecture study here. What you got?

And to make an idea work you have to have a plenty of your own ideas on how to make it work. Without it you cannot invent anything. Ask engineers...

Wasn't it just what I said? An idea on how to make something work?

...

If you're not careful with all that eye rolling, you might get dizzy. I still don't get what are you so worked up about??

[Nathan Potter]

Your thinking about the new iLargeFormatCamera from Apple. It also incorporates a GPS, makes phone calls to tell the wifey you'll be late and you can access this forum for last minute searches thru the internet. The GG image turns with a finger movement. One of the best parts is using Goggle Earth for image searches and them getting directions to get there.

That's been my point exactly. A lot of the enabling LOW COST technology already exists for the digital previewing back as it was dreamed about. A lot of intriguing features have been discussed in this thread.

I've been talking about low cost implementation based on as much enabling technology as possible already available. Low res screens based on flat panel technology can very clearly be produced in 4X5 format for under $100.00 in mass production. However it would be critical to find high volume alternative uses and make use of the low cost flat panel fab process.

The utility of such a device for LF preview purposes is a different kind of question and one that drives marketing people nuts. One can see why from the responses here.

Let me say something about engineers since I've managed good sized groups of technical people in the microfabrication industry. The range of talent from scientist down to the lowly technician is astounding. Each individual has a particular kind of ability and I've found that those abilities cross both educational and experience boundaries. Idea people and innovators can be found that span the gamut from scientist to technician. In fact the thought reminds me of a janitor I once had. Evidently he had been watching a precision plating operation on a second shift. I ran into him one evening and he stopped me to show me a design he had come up with for a plating rack for square glass substrates. He had researched the whole issue of uniformity quite thoroughly so I hired him on the spot (needed help anyway). He went on to build prototypes of the design and become one of the most invaluable of the plating personel.

Nate Potter, Austin TX.

[JBrunner]

Some people are good with computers and some are better suited for shovels. There is a perfect tool for everybody out there.

P.S.
As the irony would have it, reading about the more recent of these two accidents, it appears that the computer was functioning flawlessly but was being fed erroneous data by a faulty altimeter (usually an analog instrument).

It may have been an analog altimeter, but that doesn't mean it wasn't electronic or whatever. IIRC these are radio altimeters. Analog doesn't mean much besides non-digital.

Anyway I'm all for fancy ideas and exploring ones creativity in any endeavor. I guess for me it boils down to a personal philosophy in that I have always been more interested in being a photographer than anything else and I generally find the more doodads and junk that are going with me on a camera package the less of a photographer I can be. I go out with the big camera specifically to engage in a simple, ruthlessly brutal, yet soothing activity, and batteries aren't part of that philosophy. (Ok, one of my meters has meter has a battery, but I pretend it doesn't)

Don't get me wrong, I love geewhiz, but I doubt the device would find a market, that said, most fortunes are built by ignoring the naysayers . Cool noodle.