Copal vs. Compur

[Bill_1856]

Why did Copal shutters replace Compurs? Was it because they are better? Or cheaper? Or just part of the Zeiss meltdown?

[Jim Galli]

Yes.

[Kevin Crisp]

Jim: You think better? I've certainly had good luck with 1950's compurs and we'll see how the copals do when they get that old. I've certainly had my share of copal problems.

[Jim Galli]

Jim: You think better? I've certainly had good luck with 1950's compurs and we'll see how the copals do when they get that old. I've certainly had my share of copal problems.

Compur's seem fussier oftener to me. Maybe it's the dry desert air.

[Frank Petronio]

Late model 1970s-90s Compurs feel like they're higher quality than Copals of the same age. But Copal parts are easier to find and cheaper.

[BrianShaw]

Compur's seem fussier oftener to me. Maybe it's the dry desert air.

I don't know if it is dry air or not, but I can relate to the "fussier" comment. Compurs seem to have a greater need for being clean and properly lubricated, whereas Copals seem to be willing to run even when a little dirty and dry. In my mind Compurs are the equivelent of a fine Swiss watch and Copals are the equivelent of a Japanese copy of a fine Swiss watch: both can tell decent time.

[Atul Mohidekar]

I have a lens mounted in Compur 3 that was probably manufactured in mid 1980s. Subjectively, this shutter feels heavy duty and is EXTREMELY smooth compared to Copal shutters.


// Atul

[Gene McCluney]

My opinion, I think it was economics. The Compur (brand) made in Germany could not compete price wise with the Copal brand, thus lenses mounted in Compur shutters could not be sold for the same price as if they were mounted in Copal. Large Format lenses are expensive enough already..
So probably, lens makers trended towards Copal shutters to keep prices down, and Compur shutter sales fell to the point of being unprofitable.

[Bob Salomon]

Prontor Werke, the manufacturer of Compur and Prontor shutters, discontinued the manufacture of all mechanical shutters in the late 90s. They gave each of their customers (Rodenstock, Schneider, etc.) the opportunity to place one last order for shutters with no guarantee that they would be able to ship all of the shutters ordered (in other words the orders were limited to parts and shutters already on hand). When those orders were shipped Prontor Werke stopped delivery and production of all mechanical shutters. They still manufacture the Prontor Magnetic shutters but they do not manufacture a controller for it for photographic applications (they discontinued their controller and exposure meter system for the Prontor Magnetic System in the mid 80's) Some manufacturers do sell a controller for the Prontor Magnetic shutter (that is what the Schneider Electronic shutter actually is). But these are rather expensive shutters and would not really replace the line of mechanical shutters like the Compur and Prontor Professional which were made in 0, 1 and 3 sizes at the end.

So that left Copal as the survivor in the mechanical shutter market. Other shutters currently available include the Rollei Linear Motor, Copal Press and the Prontor Magnetic (Rodenstock also sells a controller for this shutter and the Horseman ISS shutter. Like the Prontor Magnetic and the Rollei Linear Motor shutters the ISS is also driven electronically and requires a controller.

As a reference the Copal is made in 0,1 and 3 sizes. Copal Press in 0 and 1 sizes. Rollei in 0 and 1 sizes, Prontor Magnetic in 0 and 1 sizes and the ISS is available in 0, 1 and 3 sizes.

So you are aware, some companies like Linhof did offer spare Compur shutters in their programs as recently as 2000. But none are left at any lens or camera manufacturer for resale today.

[Bob Salomon]

As an aside to this question the inventor of the shutter that became the Compur shutter was Valentin Linhof which he invented in the 1890s and sold to companies like Kodak and Voigtlander, Goerz, Steinheil, Zeiss, etc. When he sold the shutter design to Fredrich Deckel company (one deckel building is still next door to the Linhof factory in Munich). Deckel shutters were eventually was absorbed into the Zeiss family and became part of Prontor Werke and that shutter that Linhof invented became the Compur shutter.

And that Prontor Magnetic shutter system with controller was the Prontor Autolux system. This was Prontor's version of the Sinar Electronic shutter and metering system.