I take it we can no longer buy a Chamonix for $700?

[mccormickstudio]

I think the price on ebay reflects a demand greater than the current supply. It's easier and safer (at least perceived to be) for a buyer to buy through ebay. Combine that with waiting time, I can certainly see why the prices are running up. Take a look at the bid history for the $970 from ebay -- It looks like the buyer was willing to go much higher!

http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.d...m=200209028295

I'm interested to see where the Phillips Explorer 8x10 goes on ebay. I made an offer (what I thought was a good offer - almost the original price) to the seller before he decided to list on ebay. With Phillips out of production, it will be interesting to see if this fine camera becomes more or less valuable. Coincidentally, when my Phillips offer was rejected I ordered an 8x10 Chamonix with an additional 4x10 back. Tracking tells me it just landed at JFK and needless to say I'm very anxious!

[audioexcels]

Coincidentally, when my Phillips offer was rejected I ordered an 8x10 Chamonix with an additional 4x10 back. Tracking tells me it just landed at JFK and needless to say I'm very anxious!

To all those that posted, thank you for your very informed and excellent posts.

You definitely made the correct decision IMHO. Sure, a Phillips seems to be in high demands since they are what now, a rare banquet camera since they are no longer in business, or at least for now aren't??? Zone gets drilled by other cameras on the used in terms of price to performance goes. I have seen used Zones sell for $500 or so but they are, in spite of weight, in an entirely different league than the Tach/Wista/etc.

Chamonix is already considered an updated Philips, so again, no consideration to which choice should have been made. I'm going to guess that Phillips goes for an absurd price. Chamonix plainly looks a LOT better IMHO than the Phillips, though I think the Compact looks quite sexy and perhaps better than either the Explorer or Chamonix. As far as I'm concerned, with wood type cameras, the only ones I'd consider if I was going to buy a larger cam is the Chamonix, Ritter, or another company with a nice design like these two that are both simplistically intuitive, rigid, light, and gorgeous.

[Ted Harris]

Sure, a Phillips seems to be in high demands since they are what now, a rare banquet camera since they are no longer in business, or at least for now aren't???

RH Phillips is still very much in business, where did you get the idea they weren't? Dick is cutting way back on camera building to do more shooting and printing of hi own work but he hasn't stopped building cameras. He is concentrating on 8x10 and 4x5 right now, at least that is his current plan.

[Don Hutton]

Sure, a Phillips seems to be in high demands since they are what now, a rare banquet camera since they are no longer in business, or at least for now aren't???

The term banquet camera refers to format type - panoramic and usually specifically 8x20 or 12x20, although others fall into that definition too. They were used for taking "banquet portraits" which typically required a panoramic style negative which was then contact printed. Almost none of Dick Phillips' cameras fit the definition of "banquet camera" - very little of his production was ULF and while Dick did made a couple of 12x20s and a few 8x16s - those haven't been produced for many years. By far the greatest number of his production has been 4x5 and 8x10 - and these even under the broadest possible definition, are definitely not banquet cameras. If you want one of his 4x5s, give him a call and I'm sure he'll have one for you or you can get onto the list for the next run.

You need to be careful about posting incorrect information on this forum - most folks do searches here when they want information and bad information and inaccuracy simply cause this amazing resource to decline in usefulness.

[audioexcels]

The term banquet camera refers to format type - panoramic and usually specifically 8x20 or 12x20, although others fall into that definition too.

Incorrect. A Banquet Camera "is" referred to a type of camera, not "format type". The name stems from this "type of camera's" (not format) used in the past at banquets/weddings/events/etc.

They were used for taking "banquet portraits" which typically required a panoramic style negative which was then contact printed. Almost none of Dick Phillips' cameras fit the definition of "banquet camera" - very little of his production was ULF and while Dick did made a couple of 12x20s and a few 8x16s - those haven't been produced for many years.

So what is it then, a camera or a format?


By far the greatest number of his production has been 4x5 and 8x10 - and these even under the broadest possible definition, are definitely not banquet cameras. If you want one of his 4x5s, give him a call and I'm sure he'll have one for you or you can get onto the list for the next run.

I never said his cameras are banquet based cameras. I said the going rate today for one of his cameras on Fleabay is what these old Banquet cameras go for. I should have been clearer by defining the point that one rarely sees a Phillips 8X10, but when one shows up on Ebay, people go nuts over it like they do when a nice Banquet camera comes on auction. I was comparing the rarity of the Phillips with the rarity of a nice Banquet camera since both are "niche" products in the world of Ebay where billions of items are auctioned in a matter of days?

You need to be careful about posting incorrect information on this forum - most folks do searches here when they want information and bad information and inaccuracy simply cause this amazing resource to decline in usefulness.

Ted is correct that I was not informed about Phillips still making cameras. I assumed from the information gathered that he had taken a break and was not making cameras at this time, hence posted a bit too errant a response relative to Dick's present and future propositions in the LF world.

I also did not know about any other camera types that he made (ones you mentioned), though it isn't relevant to this or any thread since those cameras are in the past and we aren't talking about Dick and making ULF cameras.

You need to be careful about posting incorrect information and if you want to scrutinize any post I make, why don't you use your "usefullness" by going through every single post on this forum where you can "easily" scrutinize, correct, and make certain every member on this board has posted "accurate" information, with accordance to master Zenhutton's perfect knowledge database.

I have read a ton of posters, from moderators to people with only a few posts and I can easily take their words and flip them any which way I want and call them inaccurate. By all means, go through Ted or any Mod's posts and tell them to be careful about posting incorrect information...

[Don Hutton]

Well then, just don't post crap - that sound better to you?

[audioexcels]

RH Phillips is still very much in business, where did you get the idea they weren't? Dick is cutting way back on camera building to do more shooting and printing of hi own work but he hasn't stopped building cameras. He is concentrating on 8x10 and 4x5 right now, at least that is his current plan.

My interest in his work stemmed from the 8X10's he has produced, both very light, and very intuitively looking in design (very straightforward, in other words to make working with the camera much less complex than other more hyper looking designs). I actually only learned of his 4X5 from seeing one on Ebay. I gathered from the information around the forum that Phillips was not producing cameras at this time and is why the market is very crazed when it comes to one of his cameras coming around Ebay or even this board every now and then. I know that I for one am simply amazed by the person selling his 7X17? in the FS section. Cannot imagine ever selling something like that unless it simply wasn't being used. Even so, if the best images ever taken came from that camera, I would think the person would want to keep the puck/ball/etc. that players do from records they set

I never said anything about Dick making ULF cameras. I should be clearer when I type. As said in response to Don, I was referencing the type of craze that takes place when one of his 8X10's comes to the market which is no different than when a banquet based camera comes to the market. I was "specifically" referring to this current auction and how at present time or at least in the recent months/half year, there has been a huge flood towards the larger cameras offered on Ebay, whether for collectors or not.

I remember a while back when that gorgeous setup was being sold by I think Clay? and he could not sell it for the life of him. Now these things are selling like hotcakes anytime they come around as if they are a museum treasure.

Sorry I was not explanatory enough and ran words through too quickly to make it sound like I was making any sort of comparison of Dick's work to banquet cameras (aside from the rarity of both and how the market has really shown a lot of craze especially recently towards both of these types of products).

As said above, I only became interested in Phillips when I learned about the weight of his 8X10 cameras and it became one to have on my list of things to look out for.

I think I was also always of the impression that Phillips "was" a relatively productive camera maker due to the few reviews seen on his cameras and not others on the market, but that maybe he was in fact much more productive in the past and not so much so at present or forward thinking time? I do not know as I mentioned, I know very little about the history on him and only know of the 8X10 from reviews.

Sorry and thank you for elaborating on his status at present-future time with respect to bringing more or less cameras to the LF world.

[audioexcels]

Well then, just don't post crap - that sound better to you?

Sounds fair enough ignorantly blissful banquent unknowledgeable hypocrit...

[Don Hutton]

Sounds fair enough ignorantly blissful banquent unknowledgeable hypocrit...

Calling Dick Phillip's cameras "banquet cameras" as a collective description is simply an incredible display of ignorance and or stupidity. I've actually owned a couple of his cameras and know a little bit about them - I don't as a rule, make dumb ass postings about stuff I've never seen and no little about. Perhaps you should have a think about that...

[audioexcels]

Calling Dick Phillip's cameras "banquet cameras" as a collective description is simply an incredible display of ignorance and or stupidity. I've actually owned a couple of his cameras and know a little bit about them - I don't as a rule, make dumb ass postings about stuff I've never seen and no little about. Perhaps you should have a think about that...

Perhaps you should have a think about understanding what I am saying. You must be 60 going on a million. No age, nor banquet with a gathering of the oldest snobs of the world could possibly measure up to you.