Our old friend Chris Jordan

[Brian K]

[QUOTE=Tim Hyde;279456]

It's so simple it's not even common sense. QUOTE]

Wow. It must be comforting to be that self-certain! I think Yeats had some things to say about such passionate intensity.

Tim, it is simple, eventually demand far exceeds supply. It is inevitable. Nothing on this planet is infinite, it may seem infinite when there's only a few million people, but if we manage to get our number up to 20 billion or more we'll see how finite clean air and water is, land to live on and grow food on, places to dump our waste products,energy, etc.

When I see one of those mothers on TV being celebrated for having given birth to ten children, I don't think that's great, I think how selfish. Her need to perpetuate her DNA trumps the needs of all of us? And what quality of life is she creating for the future generations of her offspring?

We're on a lifeboat floating in space, it only has so much food and water and can maintain only so many people. Why do so few people comprehend this?

[Michael T. Murphy]

Well, Chris is linked from Radiohead's main page, about 3 links down from the top. THAT is good enough for me - case closed!


I remember when we were young, we would drink the water directly from Lake Superior, it seemed so clean. The largest fresh water lake in the world - how could it ever become polluted? Well, it is .... and we were probably being poisoned with taconites from mining operations at the time anyway.

As James Cambell says, we need new myths - religions - to fit our global reality. The old tribal myths no longer work.

The closest I have found is Buddhism.

Here is a link to the Metta Sutra, which the 100,000 protestors and monks in Burma were chanting whenm they were gunned down .... (metta means compassion or loving-kindness)

http://www.bpf.org/html/whats_now/20.../Metta1-pg.pdf

This is what should be done
By one who is skilled in goodness
Having glimpsed the state of perfect peace,
Let them be able, honest and upright,
Gentle in speech, meek and not proud.

...

Also, let them not do the slightest thing
That the wise would later reprove.
Let them cultivate the thought:
May all be well and secure,
May all beings be happy

..

Whether visible or invisible,
And those living far or near,
The born and those seeking birth,
May all beings be happy

...

Just as with her own life
A mother shields her child,
her only child, from hurt
Let all-embracing thoughts
For all beings be yours.

Cultivate a limitless heart of goodwill
For all throughout the cosmos,
In all its height, depth and breadth --
Love that is untroubled
And beyond hatred or enmity. .....




And, yes, this is 100% on topic! The question is - how do we conduct ourselves, going forward, to ensure a future for our children.

Best,
Michael

* FREE BURMA - BOYCOTT CHINESE OLYMPICS *

[Marko]

This being the 21st century, what we really need is more science rather than more religion and/or myths. The existing ones have only contributed to the overcrowding and dummification of the populace.

[Vaughn]

This being the 21st century, what we really need is more science rather than more religion and/or myths. The existing ones have only contributed to the overcrowding and dummification of the populace.

"In this late age of civilization, as our previous myths and religions grow old, science has arisen to take their place, offering new names for the same old cloud of unanswered questions. The new scientific paradigm presents a shimmering, unknowable reality full of mysterious quarks and pions and gluons and antiprotons and strong and weak forces, leaving us, in the end, with uncertainty, except for the probability that we still don't know anything."

Wes Nisker, "Crazy Wisdom"

"Atoms are not things" Werner Heisenberg

"When it comes to atoms, language can only be used as in poetry." Niels Bohr (father of quantum mechanics)

Be aware, Marko...in a way, you are just suggesting replacing myths with myths...

Vaughn

[Marko]

Be aware, Marko...in a way, you are just suggesting replacing myths with myths...

No, not really. I'm merely suggesting questioning them. All of them. That's the main difference between myths and science, you see - the former aim to provide answers to all questions, while the latter aims to question all answers.

In another famous man's words:

"The Bible shows the way to go to heaven, not the way the heavens go"

[walter23]

Predictions of the earth's carrying capacity get tricky.

That's true, but you don't need to know the numbers to know that population, and The Economy, cannot grow indefinitely, unless we come up with a technology that manufactures food and energy (and copies of that technology) for nothing. I'm not betting on that one.

[walter23]

It's so simple it's not even common sense.

Wow. It must be comforting to be that self-certain! I think Yeats had some things to say about such passionate intensity.

People eat things. Things have to grow. Growing things takes up physical space in finite cultivable lands on a finite sized planet.

This isn't fanaticism. It's simple algebra. (Or calculus if you want to start thinking about population dynamics and exponential growth). The fact that the planet is larger than you can imagine doesn't mean it's infinite. It's not larger than I can imagine, and ignoring my perspective it's demonstrably finite. You can get on a Jet Powered Aerocraft and circumnavigate the globe if you don't believe me.

You don't have to know what the numbers are (carrying capacity of planet), unless you're some cranky old selfish coot who hopes to die of a heart attack before there are any consequences for you.

[Don Miller]

At first I thought Chris was doing sculpture, like this:

http://www.hammer.ucla.edu/exhibitions/46/

Of course if you make graphic art with photoshop at print it really, really big, it's the same thing.....

[Michael T. Murphy]

Our brains are programmed - evolved - to think in terms of holistic images (pre-verbal images.) That gives rise to archetypes, dreams, ie: myths.

You do not overturn millions of years of evolution in 100 years. We are programed to work visually - we as artists *must* undertsnd that.

New myths? Batman, McDonalds, Best Buy, American Girl, Linsey Lohan, et. al. And with infinite copyright for large corporations, we cannot take our myths back, even once they enter the public domain! Go try to make your *own* Snow White movie!!

Read Jung. Read Campbell. The image, dream, myth is primary in the construction of our brain (collerctive unconcious; wisdom of the body.) The verbal is secondary.

If we don't understand how image/myth functions, we are at the mercy of the corporations and our govenmenmt.

What is wrong with tribal myths? It is always good vs. evil, us vs. them. We can't *afford* that kind of thinking anymore in a global society!

"All beings, one body." Because it is true! That is the story - *myth* - of evolution!

We inhertited the precusrosr to eyesight from a bacteria 4 billion years ago. Our ancestor. Should be a sacred god to photogs

And at the end of space/time? Still something, or nothing? What is *beyond* the absolute speed of light? 12 dimension string theory?

Damned if I know! But I love my son; that is all I need to know. That love needs to propogate to the future, or *all* life is doomed, because we can destroy it.

The higher regions of the brain, ultimately, are merely a servant of the heart and the feelings of the old brain. It is a late addition from an evolutionary standpoint.

In fact, it is an additional *organ* of evolution, that allows us to evolve from learning as well as genetics (as do many of the older facilities we share with the dog. etc.) But, no heart, no existence over the long term. The brain is *guaranteed * to "f" us up on it's own! (See Dr. Strangelove, Hitler, and the Marquis de Sade.)


This is the only way out:

Just as with her own life
A mother shields her child,
her only child, from hurt
Let all-embracing thoughts
For all beings be yours.


Best,
Michael

[walter23]

Should be a sacred god to photogs

My god is a lowly mollusk with a pinhole lens eye!

http://www.weichtiere.at/english/mollusca/eyes.html