Whole Plate (6.5X8.5) vs. larger Sized Cameras (8X10 and larger)

[David Karp]

I really can't answer all of the questions, because my experience with an 8x10 camera is limited to using a Calumet C-1 for a while. Here is why I recently decided to purchase a whole plate camera instead of an 8x10.

I recently purchased an Improved Seneca whole plate camera. The size and weight are closer to a 5x7 camera than most 8x10s. It is as light as my Walker Titan 4x5. To me, it seemed like the perfect compromise between a smaller camera that is easier to carry, and an 8x10. Plus, after laying out the size of the negative/contact print on a piece of paper, I found that I liked the proportions, and that they matched the size of some cropped enlargements from 35mm that I have done.

For me, the whole idea is to have a nice sized contact print without having to break my back lugging the camera around.

Also, the lenses usable with whole plate are smaller and often less expensive than many of those used with 8x10. All of the lenses I will use are in No. 1 shutters.

Also, I don't see any reason why not to matt, frame and hang a contact print on the wall. Unless you print to fit a specific size space on the wall, the whole plate size seems (to me) to be plenty large for display, while having the added benefit of being a nice size to hold in the hand as well.

[Jim Galli]

pros - cons:

Film and holders are much harder to get. 8X10 is common by comparison.

I don't find 8X10 unmanageable in the least so the smaller lighter argument holds little if any weight for me at l east.

8X10 2D Kodak has proved my most valuable asset as far as finished product. It's relatively light and takes a 6 1/2" packard shutter inside the camera that works with some semi-giant lenses. Much bigger than a Deardorff would tolerate.

So cake and eat it too is a 6.5 X 8.5 back for the 810 Kodak. That way if I'm in the mood for full plate I can enjoy some pretty eclectic lenses on the more eclectic format.

pros:

may be the not so ordinary size which is becoming ordinarier every time we have these discussions and more old cameras get snapped up.

The contacts just look gorgeous on a piece of 11X14 paper with a mask that leaves the white rebate. They are jewel like.

[Colin Graham]

For me, the whole idea is to have a nice sized contact print without having to break my back lugging the camera around.

Me too. Full plate seems to be the perfect size, generally I enlarge & crop 4x5 to this size. I'm seriously trying to resist making another camera and the film holders to go with it. :-[

[audioexcels]

pros - cons:

Film and holders are much harder to get. 8X10 is common by comparison.

I don't find 8X10 unmanageable in the least so the smaller lighter argument holds little if any weight for me at l east.

8X10 2D Kodak has proved my most valuable asset as far as finished product. It's relatively light and takes a 6 1/2" packard shutter inside the camera that works with some semi-giant lenses. Much bigger than a Deardorff would tolerate.

So cake and eat it too is a 6.5 X 8.5 back for the 810 Kodak. That way if I'm in the mood for full plate I can enjoy some pretty eclectic lenses on the more eclectic format.

pros:

may be the not so ordinary size which is becoming ordinarier every time we have these discussions and more old cameras get snapped up.

The contacts just look gorgeous on a piece of 11X14 paper with a mask that leaves the white rebate. They are jewel like.

For Jim and everyone else that has been responding...thank you very much for all of your views. It is obvious I will be working with 6.5X8.5. I'm now beginning to get a little more curious after what one mentioned with the .5 sizes looking a little nicer than the more standard sizes we have to work with. My memory is terrible for my age, but hopefully I mentioned that I have a 10X12 capable of going 11X14 (though I have no one to build me a back for it and wouldn't know who/where/etc. to start with in having one made). I think I may just have to keep a hold on both of these cameras and start looking for some woodworking types that know how to put together some backs for me so I can start shooting. I've been really heartless without the ability to be out and shooting in these gorgeous places of nature along the Oregon coast...

By the way Jim, those 11X14 shots with the $65 lens are rediculously sharp and amazing. I surely wouldn't mind a few $65 lenses and a custom 11X14 back built for my "large" cam=9lbs with current 10X12 back

Maybe it's time to post a "wanting someone to build me backs" post...

Ahhh...on a last note, I enjoyed seeing the difference of perspective with the 8X10 and 6.5X8.5 shots...it shows what one can expect to see as the difference when shooting the same lens but with only one size smaller/larger film...I think it would be great to see someone post a series of photos of one scene, with backs from 8X10 or even larger down to 4X5 to show the perspective change each time you change the film size/back.

[Steve Hamley]

Build a back? Richard Ritter. Very reasonable and good work.

http://www.lg4mat.net/

Steve

[audioexcels]

Build a back? Richard Ritter. Very reasonable and good work.

http://www.lg4mat.net/

Steve

Hi Steve,

I'm a little worried that it might cost 1/2 as much or as much as what I paid for my camera/s to have a back or two made by him. I'm kinda looking for the middle man that knows his stuff and can do as good of a job on a more bartering type of cost basis. If I had a $2K camera, I would have no problem sending the camera off to Richard or anyone that is well recognized. Hope this makes sense and thanks for the link. He has a very nice site and I will email him in any event just to get an idea. I am going to assume it's the price I paid for my camera, though...

Regards!

[Sal Santamaura]

..."Do I want to deal with custom-sized film and custom-sized filmholders ($$$ unless you can find good used ones)...

Each of the two annual Ilford special order periods thus far have seen me purchase whole plate FP4 Plus at prices somewhat lower than those for stock 8x10 boxes of the same film. Fotoman Camera is planning to offer, probably by July, brand new plastic whole plate film holders with a price between those of 5x7 (which Fotoman will also offer) and 8x10. Both film and holders new and competitively priced.

...If you're really into the whole plate format, money is not an issue (for new equipment...

In addition to reasonably priced new film holders, I've been told that an Asian camera manufacturer is considering a small run of whole plate cameras, depending on demand. Should anyone have interest, I suggest voicing it early and often!

[Randy H]

Colin, Audioexcels
Check with Scott-- here on this site for custom or standard backs. He just finished a back for his camera, a lensboard for mine and others. His work is excellent quality and extremely well priced.

[Steve Hamley]

Each of the two annual Ilford special order periods thus far ... In addition to reasonably priced new film holders, I've been told that an Asian camera manufacturer is considering a small run of whole plate cameras, depending on demand. Should anyone have interest, I suggest voicing it early and often!

Sal,

I support the whole plate format. I still think that CURRENTLY waiting on custom-cut film is less workable than cutting down 8x10 film which means the method is less workable than cutting down an 8x10 print - camera weight not withstanding. Waiting on an Asian manufacturer to allegedly produce film holders is not viable until the filmholders have been produced and proven in use.

It would be wonderful if the whole plate format revived, especially if filmholders were reasonably priced. BTW, I currently have an 8x10 print to be matted at 6-1/2" x 8-1/2" in an 11x14 mat.

Cheaper than a current whole plate camera, film holders, and film by multiple thousands of dollars. If you're committed to the format without reservation (NOT shooting 8x10), then have at it. But trimming an 8x10 print is clearly the most cost-efficient method especially given commercially available film formats in B&W and color. See Jim Galli's post.

I admire your camera and comittment to the format! I'd like to have one too.

Steve

[Paul Droluk]

Each of the two annual Ilford special order periods thus far have seen me purchase whole plate FP4 Plus at prices somewhat lower than those for stock 8x10 boxes of the same film. Fotoman Camera is planning to offer, probably by July, brand new plastic whole plate film holders with a price between those of 5x7 (which Fotoman will also offer) and 8x10. Both film and holders new and competitively priced.

In addition to reasonably priced new film holders, I've been told that an Asian camera manufacturer is considering a small run of whole plate cameras, depending on demand. Should anyone have interest, I suggest voicing it early and often!

FOTOMAN UPDATE... we are very close to producing our new 4x10 holders, having already seen two pre-production runs and made the appropriate "tweaks" to the molds. As mentioned previously, the 4x10 holders are our guinea pigs. So far all is looking very good indeed. Testing will commence with the samples from the next pre-production run (about 10 days), which puts us on target (July) for the 5x7 and WP holders... assuming testing goes as anticipated.

Other developments... we will be producing both a 5x7 and WP camera to round out our PS series of large format cameras. Also in the works... economical pre-cut 4x10, 5x7 and WP sized B&W film (ISO 100 - ERA Brand). Film testing is in process... if it compares to FP4 Plus (what we've heard from others), film would be available about the same time as our holders.