Coca-Cola at Fine-Wine Prices?

[paulr]

Interesting examples. Of course it's true that most art is derivative ...

I wouldn't say these are examples of art being derivative. Derivative art is usually understood to be art that cops another artist's vision or style or technique or point of view ... that doesn't offer anything new on its own.

Tim's examples are all of artists with unique, original visions that made reference to earlier works (or used them as jumping-off points). Picasso takes inspiration from the postcard (as he did from Delacroix in a whole series based on the French artist's paintings), but the final work is unmistakeably Picasso's.

Wall's image pays homage to Ellison's novel, but its look and technique and impact aren't like anything else I've seen.

[r.e.]

Hope I wasn't a crashing bore.

Scepticism plus an open mind is a long way from boring

See the show and come to your own conclusion. Given where you live, a day or two in San Francisco, enjoying a beautiful city and seeing a show that by turns makes one smile and makes one think, does not sound to me like hardship

[Colin Graham]

Good point Paul. Derivative was not the correct word to use, and I meant nothing derogatory by using it. I only meant that most art has its roots in something else, and that is a natural progression.

I am to a great extent relieved by this because I'm becoming increasingly aware that I've been putting a lot of odd restraints on my own work and feel a lot of possibilities opening up.

[Colin Graham]

Thanks r.e., I just might do that.

[Daniel Otranto]

People hated Atgets work too and he died penniless IIRC.

Aesthetics should be born, not followed.

[scrichton]

It takes a special kind of person to compare airing one's views to something Adolph Hitler did. What a moron.

I hate to say it but that statement in itself is moronic. Hitler hated modern Art, tore the Bauhaus to shreds and destroyed the berlin culture of artistry and modern movements. Due to nothing other than his own personal opinon. He was no more or less opionated than others. He just had a big army that listened to him. Plus an entire contry that though he was doing the "right" thing.

Banksy the graffiti artist is put in Jail by those in power and has become a modern artisitc hero with his simplisitic images. Such as Wall's.

Art is all perceptual, my girlfriend won a BAFTA film award last month in glasgow for a 5 minute film of an air raid siren in a field of sheep. It was beautiful. Nothing more. Others hated it.

Back to the main point though. I had a lengthy discusssion about hitler tonight and genocide and war aside, he liked classical art and really didn't understand modern art. Therefore the comparison is a just one.

To prove this ... as a tester go and look at the bauhaus literature... berlin street diaries and then finally open your opinons. Remember Von Braun made america win the space race ... One of hitlers closest friends, not all of the hitler nazi stuff was evil.

[Melchi M. Michel]

I hate to say it but that statement in itself is moronic. Hitler hated modern Art. . .

I don't want to take sides here, but the comparison to Hitler was clearly meant to discredit Jorge's point of view by association. I think what Jorge meant to point out was that this is a well-known logical fallacy (see http://www.nizkor.org/features/falla...sociation.html). Somewhat like implying that anyone who paints landscapes is like Hitler (i.e., since Hitler painted landscapes), and that his/her arguments should therefore be distrusted.

See also Godwin's Law: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hitler_rule

[JW Dewdney]

I don't want to take sides here, but the comparison to Hitler was clearly meant to discredit Jorge's point of view by association. I think what Jorge meant to point out was that this is a well-known logical fallacy (see http://www.nizkor.org/features/falla...sociation.html). Somewhat like implying that anyone who paints landscapes is like Hitler (i.e., since Hitler painted landscapes), and that his/her arguments should therefore be distrusted.

See also Godwin's Law: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hitler_rule

You don't even know what you're talking about - so please leave the oblique slander back in high school, okay?
Making a statement like that is ignorant and irresponsible. If you have a personal issue with me, then please e-mail me directly - and I'd be happy to attempt to clarify.

[JW Dewdney]

Imy girlfriend won a BAFTA film award last month in glasgow for a 5 minute film of an air raid siren in a field of sheep. It was beautiful. Nothing more. Others hated it.

Please excuse the slang - but that's fuckin' brilliant! Is it on the 'net anywhere where one can see it?