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Thread: Backing Up Digital Images

  1. #21

    Join Date
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    Re: Backing Up Digital Images

    I've worked here in Silicon Valley as a test engineer for three decades mainly in computers and networking equipment. However never worked directly on storage products like hard drives etc so my input below is from a modest technical perspective.

    One thing missing in the equation most of us doing backups are familiar with is there is more to guaranteeing long term data reliable than simply backing data up and then placing that media into long term storage. Each form of storage media goes through a period of quality evolution where data integrity gets increasingly more reliable until newer technologies appear and the old technology becomes neglected and static. Consider what has happened to magnetic tape backups. Unless one transfers information from old tape backups to newer storage media, it becomes increasingly difficult to even run appropriate applications on current computers and opeating systems to read that data back. Not only does the hardware go out of production but so does product support and data standards. Often the whole companies that had anything to do with the technology have come and gone. Consumer products are just horrible in this way while commercial and corporate product support tends to last longer as long as someone can make money from it.

    The micro electronic devices being created today are mind bogglingly complex and tiny. Internal device structures required to maintain opeational functionality are sometimes just a few molecules wide. Manufacturer's engineer such devices to work for the expected lifetime of those products plus a few more years. However that does not guarantee that some transistor material structure inside one of these devices is still going to maintain its physical integrity years beyond that lifetime. There are just a lot of chemical and atomic level things that molecular matter does over long periods that one cannot be sure about unless someone took time to actually do the science and engineering to know that. So our electronic devices, our storage media, all have large unknowns into the distant future. There may be some understanding by scientists where some of these things loose reliability but not much of that filters down to the rest of us. Fortunately most of us probably don't care what happens even 20 years hence with curent media. Heck there might be hand-sized cameras by then with a couple orders of magnitude better resolution and quality making anything our generation is creating of small value. Still don't go burying your CD's in the ground while intending to dig them up 50 years from now in order to be able to read data off them.

    Another issue is what one is doing with the storage media to guarantee data is still ok. I backed up many CD's from the mid 90's that generally seemed ok. Like the FAT tables remained fine as well as most files. But then I'd come across a few image files that when opened by Photoshop showed the usual colorful thin lines of corrupted data segments. If that happens on the fat table or other key structures, the whole media may be hosed. So really what one ought to be doing is periodically running comparison software for each of two sets of identical media backups in order to catch when errors crop up. That of course requires two complete storage systems running on the same computer whether that is two CD drives, two DVD drives, two backup hard drives.

    And then as new storage technology comes out, transfering all the old backups into new. And did you bother to somehow record what is on each backed up media? Think you'll actually remember even ten years later? Or will you have to dig through each one inefficiently in order to rediscover what each contains? No doubt much might be tossed. It if one actually knows contents without accessing media dealing with a pile of stored media becomes far more efficient. Recently I thought about this, so before my long term backups get out of hand, I'm going to start making file listings of every piece of media I use for backups that gets saved separately. ...David

  2. #22
    C. D. Keth's Avatar
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    Re: Backing Up Digital Images

    Quote Originally Posted by Kirk Keyes View Post
    Neil -
    RAID 5.
    Bingo!

    This is what video has gone to and it's awesome. You can set this up with a group of hard drives, a power supply, and whatever cheapo PC case you want. You can go rack-mount if you have enough data and/or the cash. I remember hearing from an editor friend that it's so good these days that you can (theoretically) lose 90% of the raw data and still restore it to at least 99% whole again. Since the chances you would lose that much data are very small with an array in the first place, your chances of no losses are very good.

    The best thing you can do on the cheap is use everything surge protected and then disconnect drives and unplug them completely when you're not using them.

  3. #23
    Kirk Gittings's Avatar
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    Albuquerque, Nuevo Mexico
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    Re: Backing Up Digital Images

    I have gone to dual 750 gb eSata drives for the speed. One primary and one copy. When it starts getting full, I download non-important images (low stock potential) to double copy DVDs. When the drive gets full of important images I will shelve it and buy more.
    Thanks,
    Kirk

    at age 73:
    "The woods are lovely, dark and deep,
    But I have promises to keep,
    And miles to go before I sleep,
    And miles to go before I sleep"

  4. #24

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
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    Portland, OR
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    Re: Backing Up Digital Images

    Neil -thanks for the thread. It gave me the incentive to get my Linux Samba pseudo-RAID Server up and running again. rsync was copying away as I left the house this morning.

    Kirk

  5. #25

    Re: Backing Up Digital Images

    Quote Originally Posted by claudiocambon View Post

    A friend has a hot swappable set-up that lets you pop drives in and out; I haven't seen it yet, but it looks to be the wave of the future. That way the individual drives cost a lot less, because you aren't buying the shell, just the drive.
    Claudio, could you ask your friend for the brand and model names of this device, and report to the forum?

    Thanks in advance
    Hening

  6. #26

    Re: Backing Up Digital Images

    Hening

  7. #27

    Re: Backing Up Digital Images

    Sorry,
    the name is Icy Box - Icy Dock is a different product.
    Hening

  8. #28

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
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    South Carolina
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    5,506

    Re: Backing Up Digital Images

    I believe the most archival way to back up your digital images would be to make CMYK separations on panchromatic film.

    Sandy King

  9. #29

    Join Date
    Nov 2006
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    SF Bay Area
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    198

    Re: Backing Up Digital Images

    Back in the day, I archived a lot of images on these things called JAZZ and ZIP disks. Unfortunately, these became obsolete to CD disks. CDs are much more economical, but the labor to transfer and maintain the archive makes me glad I still have a negative. Some of the ZIPs were DOA also.

    Currently, I make an effort to make duplicate CDs or DVDs of all work that is stored. I still have negatives also, which IMO is the most time tested proven system.

    Here is a list of CD archive voodoo I have picked up over the years. Maybe someone here can tell me if I'm wrong about these.

    1. Protect the top surface as well as the underside. If the top surface gets damaged, the CD is dead.

    2. Don't use alcohol based markers (sharpie, etc) to mark your CDs or DVDs. Over time these marks will destroy the top layer of the disk.

    3. Store disks inside jewel cases to protect them.

    4. Be very careful of the humidity and temperature of where you store your archive. High humidity and heat can destroy a disk.

    5. Burn the disks at a slower speed to insure it sticks better. (this one really seems like voodoo, but I do it anyhow )

    After my ZIP and JAZZ experience, I am very hesitant about storing a huge archive on one hard drive. I think redundancy on multiple disks is the best call for me.

  10. #30

    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Portland, OR
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    743

    Re: Backing Up Digital Images

    How about this from the Google home page:

    "Free email with 2.8GB storage and less spam. Try Gmail today."

    Email yourself the data and store it as attachments as a really cheap way to get nearly GB of storage.

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