16 bits Worth It? & Mounting Station Options

[chandlerrichardsceo]

Hello all,

It's been a long time since I broke out my DTS Screen 1030AI, but I still wonder about upgrading to a better scanner. I got mine for a hundred bucks some years ago from a liquidator cleaning out a publishing house; so, for the money, it was definitely a good deal. With so few options on the market, I have kept my eyes open for options that aren't a fortune and close enough for decent shipping. Recently, I found a couple options a few hours away from me. They're both Howtek Scanmasters, one a 4500 and one a 7500, both with mounting stations and software. One is capable of 12 bits per color at 5000 dpi, and the other can do 16 bits per color at 4000 dpi. My 1030AI can manage 8 bits per color at 5200 dpi. For those knowledgeable, is there a large enough difference in image quality to justify the cost of jumping from 8 bits to 12 bits? Further, would achieving 16 bits be worth decreasing to 4000 dpi? I mostly shoot 8x10 transparencies these days, at least for LF, but I also have a large back-catalogue of neg and slide 35mm, 120, 4x5, and 8x10 that I would like scan. As Cibachrome bit the dust a decade ago, I figure drum scanning is the best option I have for creating prints of my LF slides. I'd also like to hear from people who have made contact internegatives for printing slides as to whether they can do the original slides justice. As for scanning, I have read that for LF scans, anything above 4000 dpi is a waste and that bits per color is more important.

Concerning the second topic of this thread, I have always done my scans without the help of a mounting station. However, one of the reasons I haven't scanned in so long is my frustration with the pain and constant do-overs when trying to mount film onto drums without a mounting station. Thus, I am looking for information on where I could purchase or commission a mounting station for my current scanner. I will look through the 1030ai groups.io page to see if they have any ideas. While I have become mechanically adept over the years thanks to my other anachronistic hobby of classic cars, I am not much of a fabricator. Besides, I lack the tools for making a mounting station. I recall reading somewhere a few years ago of a company in Australia that would make mounting stations on order.

In personal news, I am happy to say my 4x5 enlarger will collect dust no longer. I have finally finished moving, and I now have space to make set up a more permanent darkroom. I'm excited to try my hand at contact printing. As I really only shoot slides, both 8x10 and 120 for medium format stereo, I have never done much printing, despite having this enlarger for years. I snagged it from a studio that was closing down for free; so, another good deal. I've also been keen to pick up my old experiment of 4x5 and 8x10 stereo. I made one set of 8x10's that showed inconclusive results, though it wasn't a good choice of subject for the matter and before I had a proper camera for the job. I have to get another aerial stereoscope before taking more pairs. And I hope to finally pursue the 8x10 astrophotography project I've wanted to do for years. I bet slides of that size would look amazing. Have to find the right scope and mount first though. If anything comes of these ventures, I'll be sure to post about it.

Happy New Year

[Joshua Dunn]

Let me state from the start I have not personally worked with either scanner but are familiar with them. My understanding is the Howtek Scanmaster 7500 is capable of 5000 dpi, see page four of this pdf. If you are doing color, 16 bits is well worth is, especially since that is what Photoshop and other editing software is capable of working in. Scanning in anything less will simply give you less information to work with. These are very expensive, I would think the 7500 with a mounting stating would be well worth it as long as the price is as reasonable as drum scanners go for.

Congrats on the darkroom and happy new years!

-Joshua

[brbo]

They're both Howtek Scanmasters, one a 4500 and one a 7500, both with mounting stations and software. One is capable of 12 bits per color at 5000 dpi, and the other can do 16 bits per color at 4000 dpi. My 1030AI can manage 8 bits per color at 5200 dpi. For those knowledgeable, is there a large enough difference in image quality to justify the cost of jumping from 8 bits to 12 bits? Further, would achieving 16 bits be worth decreasing to 4000 dpi?

Neither of those two scanners can do 16bit. Both are 12bit.

[SergeyT]

Internal electronics of DTS Screen 1030AI support 10-bit per channel processing. Compression to 8-bit per channel is done in the Computer(MAC or PC) Scanners software and only when the scanned and edited data is saved to the disk.
In my opinion, and from my experience with other scanners, if all the major adjustments are done in the scanner software before saving to a disk file, 8-bit per channel is absolutely sufficient to avoid any sort of badning related to bit depth. This means that when scanning, especially the negatives, all the conversion and tone+color adjustems should be done in the scanners software before saving the scans into TIFF. If any further "heavy" processing is required, once opened in Photoshop or any other similar 3rd party software, it is advisable to switch the scans from 8-bit per channel into 16-bit per channel mode.

[calebarchie]

Which Australian outfit was that? I'm Aussie and made a few a while back, considered making them to order just not enough time.

They can be simple to DIY if you go with a weighted roller design. Good luck with the search!

[Chester McCheeserton]

is there a large enough difference in image quality to justify the cost of jumping from 8 bits to 12 bits? Further, would achieving 16 bits be worth decreasing to 4000 dpi?[/B]

No. Scan in 8 bit.

Work in 8 bit - but be sure to add noise to layer masks in photoshop that contain smooth gradients.

You can switch to 16 bits per channel right before you print, just before you flatten all the layers.
Switch to 16/flatten/then switch back to 8. This will take the 'combing' out of your histogram and I believe keeps the benefits of working in 16 bit the whole time.

Also, from the tests I have done and seen, unless you are scanning tech pan film from 35mm, I do not believe you can see a difference above 4000 dpi - going higher - in a print.

For 8x10, 2000 is more than enough...any more and you are just generating massive files that will bog down your workflow.

IMO - doing careful testing to figure out what aperture is optimal to use for different film stocks and learning to not blow out important highlights or black up important shadow detail is most important.