Deardorff Bellows Replacement

[RichardRitter]

I have used custom bellows for over 25 years and have had no problems, Send the frames and they mount the bellows to the frames.

I have had customers that have sent me the China bellows to be mounted on their camera and the frame had to be mounted, sometime the frames would fit other times it was allot of work to get then mounted to the frames, not something for someone doing it for the first time. Have had bellow that were made wrong and was not overly impressed with the quality. I have a feeling they will have a shorter life. Plus on some camera where the over all thickness is impotent they were to thick.

Yes send $200 and have to replace then 3 years latter. Or as what happen to the person Michael talked about is it worth the gamble?

Steve Grimes would tell anyone asking about bellow problems that the best insurance against light leaks is to put the focusing cloth over the back of the camera and the bellows. It is still the best advice going. the bigger the camera format the more problems there are.

[Len Middleton]

The bellows from China aren't exactly inexpensive at $200 shipped. Although, $450 + shipping from Custom Bellows in the UK is considerably more expensive.

Indeed the Custom Bellows UK bellows were not cheap. Looking at my invoice from November 2011 for the replacement bellows for my Korona 8x20 Panoramic View Camera including mounting them on the frame was 290.00UKP plus "Carriage" at 56.30UKP, for a total of 346.40UKP.

The transaction was good with no issues and done relatively quickly, and certainly well within my time requirements.

In looking at the cost of the bellows and potential issues and the economics involved, my last purchase of 8x20 Ilford HP5+ resulted in a cost of about C$13 a sheet, without getting into the issue of that presumably the shoot you were to capture on that sheet was worth the cost, time, effort, and trouble...

Just my perspective on the situation realising that not everyone has the same perspective or uses the same criteria,

Len

[Lachlan 717]

I agree with the sentiments, Len, and have often argued the same thing, particularly in relation to people buying something like an Ebony camera and then asking what budget lens to put on it.

However, (and I write this having waited several years to put a bellow on my DIY 7x17" camera), I do not recall people writing that they've had issues with, say, Rudy's bellows. I have read several people highly recommending them, though.

This has nothing to do with the quality of Custom Bellows' product; they're obviously market-best. I'm just a bit worried that we're unjustifiably condemning all others when, for many users who are not shooting hundreds of sheets a year and wearing them out, Chinese bellows will easily suffice.

One other thing that makes me suspect that the Chinese bellows are fine for many is the number of Chinese cameras now out there from makers such as Shen Hao and Chamonix. I would bet that they don't use Custom Bellows' products, and, again, there is no systemic issues reported on their bellows.

[Michael Kadillak]

The bellows from China aren't exactly inexpensive at $200 shipped. Although, $450 + shipping from Custom Bellows in the UK is considerably more expensive.

I work as a executive technical consultant and my advice to you would be to shift your mindset from "expense" to "investment". Then you would not be voicing your complaint about the cost. Also consider monetizing your investment over a ten year + period rather than seeing your expense fail after two years and need replacing. A camera bellows is a critical strategic component to your photographic success.

[Michael Kadillak]

I agree with the sentiments, Len, and have often argued the same thing, particularly in relation to people buying something like an Ebony camera and then asking what budget lens to put on it.

However, (and I write this having waited several years to put a bellow on my DIY 7x17" camera), I do not recall people writing that they've had issues with, say, Rudy's bellows. I have read several people highly recommending them, though.

This has nothing to do with the quality of Custom Bellows' product; they're obviously market-best. I'm just a bit worried that we're unjustifiably condemning all others when, for many users who are not shooting hundreds of sheets a year and wearing them out, Chinese bellows will easily suffice.

One other thing that makes me suspect that the Chinese bellows are fine for many is the number of Chinese cameras now out there from makers such as Shen Hao and Chamonix. I would bet that they don't use Custom Bellows' products, and, again, there is no systemic issues reported on their bellows.

To attempt to extrapolate that Chinese bellows manufacturers are "acceptable" because Shen Hao and Chamonix don't use Custom Bellows conveys a rather convenient conclusion without any semblance of fact. I have seen first hand Shen Hao and Chaminoix bellows and they are head and shoulders above what I have seen from the "B Team". A camera manufacturer has skin in the game and will inherently ensure a sufficient amount of quality compliments the wood and metal and machining that goes into the brand name. Here from my perspective is where the rubber meets the road. When the Chinese seller (who was your Rudy) heard of the failure of the bellows he produced he immediately attempted to fix the issue with a replacement product rather than refund or attempting to explain the product failure. You do what you want with your camera. Last count I have purchased six Custom Bellows camera bellows and I have another order on my desk with the custom forms filled out for them. Even if you gave me these Chinese bellows I would not put them on my camera.

The game changer in this regard is when you tell us that you know who produces the Shen Hao and Chaminoix bellows. Until then this post is all conjecture.

[Len Middleton]

I agree with the sentiments, Len, and have often argued the same thing, particularly in relation to people buying something like an Ebony camera and then asking what budget lens to put on it.

However, (and I write this having waited several years to put a bellow on my DIY 7x17" camera), I do not recall people writing that they've had issues with, say, Rudy's bellows. I have read several people highly recommending them, though.
11

I accept the fact in this situation, I may be risk adverse.

However, looking at all the cost, effort and time involved involved and relative time constraints (lived longer than the time I likely have remaining), I accept the potential premium involved when once considers the total live cycle costs (equipment costs, cost of operation, and opportunity cost). I expect there are alternate suppliers who might be able to supply a suitable product, but it does not take much time to lose the benefit of the lower cost at C$13 per 8x20 sheet plus processing lost, plus the opportunity cost of an image I hoped to capture.

But as mentioned, that is my decision criteria and not necessarily the same used by others.

One needs to consider the total economics (equipment and operating costs) and the value of one's time, even given that I do this as a personal versus commercial effort.

Again, my perspective versus others...

Thank you for your perspective,

Len

[Lachlan 717]

T

The game changer in this regard is when you tell us that you know who produces the Shen Hao and Chaminoix bellows. Until then this post is all conjecture.

As, too, is the conjecture that only Customs Bellows' bellows are good enough. Until there are more reports that "other" bellows are crap, of course.

Many people covert Ferraris, yet still put hundreds of thousands of kilometres on Hyundais.

[Lachlan 717]

Again, my perspective versus others...

Thank you for your perspective,

Len

And thanks for yours! Good food for thought.

[Michael Kadillak]

As, too, is the conjecture that only Customs Bellows' bellows are good enough. Until there are more reports that "other" bellows are crap, of course.

Many people covert Ferraris, yet still put hundreds of thousands of kilometres on Hyundais.

Gut check. This is a niche market not one where vibrant competition exists and where you would expect to find market differentiating components like quality and innovation to exist solely to garner market share. The market share is barely on the scale. When a crap producer of products clearly acknowledges this and is taking advantage of the situation and he does not even bother to investigate the application to ensure that they fit properly, they should be promptly relegated to sidelines until they perform as well as Custom Bellows. As a sidebar. Custom Bellows used to be called Camera Bellows before they went through a reorganization recently. Fortunately the quality and the workers were retained. Where would we as a community be if enough people were of the same mindset as you such that the only bellows options were these POS wannabe's from abroad or DIY bellows.

The analogy about Ferraris is a bit of a stretch. We are talking about the difference between several hundred dollars in insurance value. I know guys that spend $10 - $25 for a sheet of 8x10 sheet film B&W / Color. They talk about the expenses of travel, gas, food and lodging let along your time. Take a two week like my friend did and look at the fogged negatives and tell me it was worth it. Even without a refund he was on the phone to Camera Bellows the next day. Your choice and I wish you well.

[Duolab123]

So I guess I will keep using my original bellows until I see a problem, haven't seen any problems yet. I bought my V8 from a elderly piano tuner, gave him his asking price of 700 bucks. Came with a Packard shutter and a big ol Wollensak (not a soft focus) and a couple holders. Took about 5 hours cleaning the dust off the thing. Haven't touched the original finish, just cleaned and used a very small amount of wax and lemon oil. I don't think I will be lugging an 8 x 10 into the outback anytime soon. Mostly want to do portraits. As pretty as these cameras are I would be taking the least risky road, sounds like the Custom Bellows folks have yet to disappoint.

My friend handed over her 8x10 Elwood enlarger we got about 30 years back to make pan shot prints. It had the bellows replaced right before we got it, some god awful rubber, plastic stuff. Boy the stuff holds up as they are like new, ugly as can be and very hard to compress. I don't want to go down this road.
Best Regards to all. Mike