movement technique for foreground above background

[David Roossien]

When shooting ice formations on Lake Michigan I often stand on the ice cliffs, select an interesting foreground that is on top of the ice cliff, and shoot out and down over the water below.

I searched the archives and found another similar discussion:

http://largeformatphotography.info/lfforum/topic/498230.html

My technique so far has been to focus on the lake and tilt the back until the foreground is sharp. Then, adjust back and forth until I have a point in the foreground nearly sharp and background sharp. I can never get both to be perfectly sharp. Then, use a sufficient f stop to bring the foreground into acceptable sharpness. This has worked fairly well for me so far, with some acceptable, though noticeable loss in sharpness in the foreground.

My question is: since the plane of focus (I hope to focus onto) is below the foreground can I ever get the plane to pass through the foreground and the background when still focused on the background?

Thank you for your thoughts and suggestions!

David

[Ralph Barker]

If I understand your scenario correctly, doesn't the desired plane of focus tilt backward, with the convergence point of the standards being above the camera?

[Kirk Keyes]

"My question is: since the plane of focus (I hope to focus onto) is below the foreground can I ever get the plane to pass through the foreground and the background when still focused on the background?"

Think about the Scheimpflug rule and think about where the planes of focus, lens, and subject are, and I think you'll find the answer is no. You are probably seeing the middle of the photo being out of focus, despite the foreground cliff and the distance are in focus.

Try using the focus spread method as described here: http://www.largeformatphotography.info/how-to-focus.html

Kirk

[David Roossien]

Ralph,

I was using backward tilt of the back standard, analogous to forward tilt of the front standard. I probably was making a mistake, but I could not get front tilt of the back standard or back tilt of the front standard to work. Maybe I should try a simple experiment at home on the table top to figure out what I'm doing wrong.

Kirk,

I think you are right--no is the answer. Visualizing the wedge that Leonard Evens describes, it is the nearest objects that have the shallowest DOF. I am seeing some softening in the foreground and middle areas--though still acceptable because I'm using a 90mm wide angle lens and stopping down to at least f32. I'm guessing there is no point in using tilt in this situation, but it would be nice for someone else to confirm this for me.

Thanks for your help!

[Ole Tjugen]

I must admit that I fail to understand your problem. Many of my pictures are shot in similar situations, often with the foreround several 100 meters above the background. You simply need a little more tilt than you would if the landscape was flat!

Most illustrations of the Scheimpflug rule show only horizontal focal plane, but that is not a limit!