Beginner's drum scanning questions concerning mounting

[Lenny Eiger]

Ive been on the Scan High-End list for many years. I have read all about Kami fluid and different claims by both sides. I have used Kami for a very long time and have had no problems whatsoever. I was at Aztek last year and Evan showed me a drum that handsome minimal crazing on it and I couldn't even see it. They are very careful with the drums that they sell. Having purchased my drums there, I figure this is why I have had no issues.

Aztek's sense of the Kami controversy is that drums craze when they are either manufactured improperly or they have been put on a lathe to be polished. If they get just a little too hot, something happens to the surface and crazing becomes a possibility. The recommend against putting a drum on a lathe for this reason. If you need to polish out scratches, do it by hand. For those who are not familiar with drums, the surface is like butter. All you have to do is touch it with a piece of metal (like your scissors, to cut a piece of tape) and you have a scratch.

However, I think its important to understand that drums are very expensive. A new one can cost $1500-$2000. That's a lot of dough. It can be quite upsetting to lose something of this value. This conversation often gets heated. I understand fully, I don't want to lose a drum, either. I think the answer is to be sure you know the history of any drums you buy, and to get a guarantee whenever you can.

Personally, I am going to buy all my drums thru Aztek. Most everything costs more there, but they will guarantee their product - at least for a certain period of time, enough to see if a drum is crazed.

Hope this helps,

Lenny

[vinny]

I don't think it's the drums that get crazed

[Sideshow Bob]

Why take a chance?

Mr.Gale

[Christian-NRW]

Got the kami stuff and so far, it handles great. The mounting fluid really evaporates without leaving a trace and the drum cleaner gets anything of with the first wipe, be it dust or tape residue. It is really far less of a mess than expected.

The problem I have is that the mylar crinkles on the side. Yesterday evening, I took the time to watch all of your mounting videos once again and noticed, that e.g. Lenny applies a bit of pressure on the roll and also applies tension to the mylar via the fixing tape. This was missing e.g. in the Aztek video. I'll give it a try, sounds very promising!

Thanks for your help,
Christian

[vinny]

yeah the aztek video doesn't resemble anything close to the way I do it because my mounting station (screen dts-1030ai) doesn't have all those rollers and acrylic flat surfaces. I use LOTS of 1/2" tesa tape about 2-3" long, there's a reason it stretches. I never put the film closer than about 3/4" to the edge of the mylar ends (8" dimension) to leave room for tape placement. When I started drum scanning, Aztek had the only video out there IIRC and I had a hell of a time with bubbles.

[Vord]

A while back I had the pleasure of meeting man that has been scanning film for the last 30 years.
At the lab he works he uses a ICG drum scanner and he mounts the film with baby oil (aka mineral oil aka paraffine liquidum).
He told me it's the way he's always done it and never had a drum with any damage, he showed me the ones he's been using for the past 5 to 10 years and they were all impeccable. Funny thing is he doesn't even use mylar, he told me it was rather pointless with most of the film they get in since it's all clean, sleeved, recently shot and developed film and if there are going to be any marks they'll mostly be on the emulsion side. Besides that he said they didn't have time for that back when they had hundreds to scan any given day. He puts the baby oil in between the emulsion side and drum and tapes the film straight to the drum itself.

[Lenny Eiger]

I don't mean to be obnoxious, but I think using baby oil is a bit crazy. I've seen it done on someone's drum scanner. It works, but it is also a mess to clean up. Oil everywhere, dust, grime? Yikes.

I have a few bottles of film cleaner here. Bought them about 10 years ago, haven't made it halfway thru the first one. I almost never use it, at most once a year. I don't like cleaning anyone's film with it. It just seems too harsh... with oil I'd have to use it on every single piece of film. Waste of time, not my idea of fun. Unnecessary. Not for me.


Lenny

[Vord]

Most film cleaners I find are made out of mostly petroleum ether, just like kami fluid.
In any case, I've seen him work, the man has great skill and experience and his scans are fantastic.
However cumbersome or nasty it might seem, he makes it work.
He said he uses baby oil since it's by far the purest easily attainable mineral oil you can get.

I figured it was worth telling considering the amount of times I've read how using oil will ruin your drums etc. etc.
10 year old drums, nothing but oil, proof enough for me.

[Lenny Eiger]

Vord,

It is very clear that if film cleaner hits the drum it will ruin it. Everyone should be aware of this.

OTOH, I can't imagine anyone saying that oil would hurt a drum. The person I observed using oil was a veteran scanner operator, someone who I respect (who actually went to scanning school back when they still and those...).

However, having seen both I think oil is quite unnecessary... all I do is wave the film in the air a couple of times after it comes off the drum and everything is clean... sometimes there is progress... and better ways of doing things as life moves forward.

Lenny

[Vord]

Obviously I'm not saying no film cleaner out there would damage a drum, I'm sure many would and you're correct to say it's inadvisable.

But the most common ones I know such as Varn film cleaner, Tetenal graphics art film cleaner, Anchor film kleen or Kami's own film cleaner would not. They are roughly made up of the same components, none of which would be harmful in their compositions as a drum cleaner.