Horseman 45HF for 6x17

[openhand]

Hey there,

Long time photographer, both digi-wigi, 35mm and for the last year full time medium format. When I got in to medium I was very close to instead going to large. I'm glad I didn't at the time but it's been niggling at me and I have ideas for some 4x5 projects, as well as getting in to ambrotypes etc. I also nearly went super-pano, instead getting the complete opposite with a 6x6 Hassy 500cm.

I love the panoramic format and so I plan to spend lots of time with a 6x17 back on my 4x5 (6x12 at least). I'll probably also shoot LF negs too, but any old camera can do that.

I travel a heap, not interested in a view camera at all really and would prefer metal over wood for construction since I know it will get some rough treatment. I know the limitations of movement on a lot of the metal cameras and I'm not too fussed. Something compact would do the job well. I had my eye on a Toyo 45A / AII for a while but I haven't seen many crop up lately (I'm in Australia too, by the way!) and they seem to have jumped in price.

I've found a Horseman 45HF which I think will go for a fair penny under $1k. It has a few lenses. The thing is ugly as hell (Brown Leather yeugh) but I don't mind. No film backs however.

Just wondering if people would advise such a thing for a first camera. I like the fact it's small and seems pretty sturdy. I know it isn't perfect, no rotating back, limits on lenses, but I don't have a bath full of money to spend on the thing (No suggesting Linhof Technikas now folks) and it seems to cover all bases pretty well. A 6x17 back is another question altogether. They don't seem to come cheap and I'm not 100% the lenses will have proper coverage for that but I'll double check.

Is there anything I'm missing out on? Anything I should take in to consideration that has passed me by entirely?

Much appreciate any advice. I might have a look on the market here too and see what's going though unfortunately I don't have the time or post history behind me for that just yet.

Thanks for your time!

[ic-racer]

Horseman never made a 6x17 back for the 45HF, though I think Badger Graphic has a Horseman 6x17 back that fits a 5x7 camera for about $3000. Otherwise, in terms of metal field cameras, the 45HF is a good value and it can take the Horseman 6x12 back. I can't comment on the value of a $1000 kit without knowing which lenses are included.

[djdister]

Since 5 inches = 12.7 cm, I don't see how you could shoot a 6x17 cm image on a 4x5 camera. That said, if you have a 5x7, there is also the Canham 6x17 motorized roll film back for $1,345. It is made for the Canham 5x7, but may work on other 5x7 cameras.

[openhand]

Does the Dayi 617 back work? It lists horseman as a fit on the website though I'm not sure if I'm looking at the wrong horseman for that.

edit: Sorry I just saw the last reply. You guys know better than me of course, but I had done reading in the past and thought I'd seen that people have pulled it off with 4x5 cameras and a lens with a good image circle. It folds out on its own little bellows for extra length too.

[vinny]

Since 5 inches = 12.7 cm, I don't see how you could shoot a 6x17 cm image on a 4x5 camera. That said, if you have a 5x7, there is also the Canham 6x17 motorized roll film back for $1,345. It is made for the Canham 5x7, but may work on other 5x7 cameras.

you CAN shoot 6x17 with a 4x5 camera, not everyone has been around long enough to see these crazy contraptions
http://www.largeformatphotography.in...6x17-film-back

[openhand]

Thanks vinny, thought it was possible with this camera even though it's not the most ideal solution. I'd rather something I can fold up and take with me compared to a dedicated camera with a big nose cone that I'll never fit in my bag. That might sound a roundabout way of doing it, but I've thought it over quite a bit.

ic-racer, sorry I forgot to answer your question: It has a 65mm, 90mm and 150mm (with an extender 2x though I'm not too fussed with that), all Super Horseman I believe. Haven't found much info on those, but I've seen a couple of comments saying they're the newer, nicer version of Horseman's lenses. It could well go for under $1000 or maybe well over, it's a listing with a while to go but not much interest so far. Not many of these come up in Australia so it's hard to pick really.

[vinny]

there's no such thing as a 2x extender for LF lenses.
ok, i stand corrected. The best place to put that thing would be the closest trash can.

[openhand]

there's no such thing as a 2x extender for LF lenses.

Apologies, 2x teleconverter for the 150mm. Here's a link showing the item. I'd not seen one for large format before but apparently it works, albeit not too sharp.

I'm not too fussed about that item in any case, I usually shoot wide if anything. Very occasionally long, never normal!

[ic-racer]

Thanks vinny, thought it was possible with this camera even though it's not the most ideal solution. I'd rather something I can fold up and take with me compared to a dedicated camera with a big nose cone that I'll never fit in my bag. That might sound a roundabout way of doing it, but I've thought it over quite a bit.

ic-racer, sorry I forgot to answer your question: It has a 65mm, 90mm and 150mm (with an extender 2x though I'm not too fussed with that), all Super Horseman I believe. Haven't found much info on those, but I've seen a couple of comments saying they're the newer, nicer version of Horseman's lenses. It could well go for under $1000 or maybe well over, it's a listing with a while to go but not much interest so far. Not many of these come up in Australia so it's hard to pick really.

The 2x makes the 150 a 300mm, so it is not really a 'teleconverter.' It is a pretty high quality item, 6 or 7 elements, but it can be difficult to focus on the HF. I use the extended bellows back (does this fit the HF, I don't know?)

The 65mm Horseman/Topcor was only made in 6x9 format, though it does just barely cover 4x5". You can focus it at infinity if you clip the front standard just hanging off the back of the focus track.

The 90mm and 150mm were made for both 6x9cm format and 4x5" format. The 6x9cm lenses are called "SUPER," the 4x5" lenses are called "LF". It would be better to have the 4x5 lenses if shooting 4x5 film.

[openhand]

Thanks very much for the info ic-racer, I was looking for 4x5 info on the lenses so it makes sense I didn't show up with much about them. The guy has said he pretty much exclusively used the kit for shooting 6x12, so that explains it.