Wanderlust 4x5 P&S

[Jim Cole]

Because silence merely allows the same unproductive bitching to repeat itself, rather than escalating into new bitching.

Nobody really believes that Ben and Justin aren't eager to be done with this. Nobody believes they are withholding information just to annoy people. Nobody believes an update from them every two hours (or two days) will make it happen any faster (though responding to every complaint here could certainly make it slower). Nobody believes Ben is saying to himself, "if those pesky LF forum guys would shut up, I could ignore this for another month."

Every time they throw out a tidbit, the bitching starts up again. There is always an insatiable desire for information, which quickly leads to unhelpful advice (you could ship it this way, or that way!), requests for special consideration (I have a trip coming up!), tales of hardship (this is my living!), special needs (can't you just send mine to me now? Wouldn't take five minutes!), and so on. I've seen all of this just in the last week. All of that is based on the squeaky wheel principle, which everybody loves if they are squeaking and hates if they are being squeaked at. And I'll bet not one soul here, myself included, hasn't struggled to get a late project done, and knows that impatience feeds on itself counterproductively. The only information that resolves questions are answers. Until they have answers, they,d be fools to feed the beast. "Nothing's happening--we are just waiting" is not information.

It just may be that they are at the mercy of providers (the shippers likely being the latest, and maybe their day-job bosses) who really don't give a damn about the people here and their squeaking.

So, that's why I say, give it a rest.

Sorry if I'm coming off grouchy, but there it is.

Rick "who has seen this cycle repeat endlessly, where an update escalates complaining rather than relieving it" Denney

Actually, just the opposite! Ben just broke the silence and gave us an estimated shipping time. No more bitching required.

How about that! Thanks, Ben. Don't mind waiting a little longer now that we know what's going on.

[BarryS]

We're 90% ready to ship the first batch (they're on pallets without labels), but the reality is that I'm on the final week of a 12 week project, and Justin is shooting all week on five sets simultaneously (five!), so we can't physically be there to move the shipment onto the truck. As much as it pains me to say it, the soonest we can do it is Thursday of next week. But in the scheme of things, this is not a long delay. And we'll have over 500 cameras (more than 1/3 our total) shipped.

So, I hate to beg your patience again, but: hang in there!

Thanks for the update!

[plywood]

Give it a rest, guys.

Rick "tired of the pointless repetition" Denney

I agree with Jim Cole, why? You don't care when, fine, we get that, but there is absolutely nothing unreasonable in any of the backers asking why, for pity's sake is it taking so long to start shipping. And, Ben responded with an reasonable explanation. That they are as super busy on their day jobs. And, he even gave an earliest date that shipping would start. I get that, it doesn't make me upset at Ben at all and Ben, I thank you for responding with that information.

[plywood]

We're 90% ready to ship the first batch (they're on pallets without labels), but the reality is that I'm on the final week of a 12 week project, and Justin is shooting all week on five sets simultaneously (five!), so we can't physically be there to move the shipment onto the truck. As much as it pains me to say it, the soonest we can do it is Thursday of next week. But in the scheme of things, this is not a long delay. And we'll have over 500 cameras (more than 1/3 our total) shipped.

So, I hate to beg your patience again, but: hang in there!

Thanks Ben, you are obviously as busy as a one armed wall paper hanger so thanks for the update.

[rdenney]

Actually, just the opposite! Ben just broke the silence and gave us an estimated shipping time. No more bitching required.

How about that! Thanks, Ben. Don't mind waiting a little longer now that we know what's going on.

Go back and review the thread. Every substantive update has brought both encouragement, and also complaints. The complaints led in new directions. The attempts at engaging the complaints led to more complaints. Attempting to answer them all would have been a full-time job.

Ben is telling you what he expects, based on what people are telling him. Supposing the shipper doesn't show up next Thursday? Ben'll have to come back on here explaining that they didn't show up, and then we'll have ten more complaints. Would not having that information about Thursday have delayed anyone receiving their camera? Not a bit.

There is a time for complaining. But every few days is too often.

If your desire is for mere communication, fine. Me? I want the camera.

Rick "productive is me having the camera, not more squeaking" Denney

[Jim Cole]

Go back and review the thread. Every substantive update has brought both encouragement, and also complaints. The complaints led in new directions. The attempts at engaging the complaints led to more complaints. Attempting to answer them all would have been a full-time job.

Ben is telling you what he expects, based on what people are telling him. Supposing the shipper doesn't show up next Thursday? Ben'll have to come back on here explaining that they didn't show up, and then we'll have ten more complaints. Would not having that information about Thursday have delayed anyone receiving their camera? Not a bit.

There is a time for complaining. But every few days is too often.

If your desire is for mere communication, fine. Me? I want the camera.

Rick "productive is me having the camera, not more squeaking" Denney

I doubt that the 2 1/2 minutes that it took Ben to write that update had any effect on the shipping date.

Jeez, some of you guys are so defensive.

Plus, most of us wouldn't care if the cameras went out a few days later. At least we have a basic schedule to work with.

The "squeaking" usually starts after a month or more of silence after Ben himself promised updates every two weeks.

[Tin Can]

Thanks Rick. If I may, I am going to plagerize and paraphrase your message as I need exactly that type of reply to endless emails I get in my volunteer work.

If I answered every squeaky special needs request that is all I would be doing.

Amazing how good deeds are always punished.

If any person can write an astounding public post right here and now why they absolutely need this camera ASAP, I will ship mine to them.

Make your appeal good, we can all vote for the most needy writer.

Not kidding. No PM's. I keep my word.

[Larry Kellogg]

I think I probably have a camera on the pallet. Woo hoo! Hang in there Ben, good luck finishing your project. I figured you guys were busy. I can wait some more.

[rfesk]

I am looking forward to receiving mine also -- but have a LOT of empathy for their situation. I agree with rdenney 1000%.

[plywood]

Ben is telling you what he expects, based on what people are telling him. Supposing the shipper doesn't show up next Thursday? Ben'll have to come back on here explaining that they didn't show up, and then we'll have ten more complaints. Would not having that information about Thursday have delayed anyone receiving their camera?

Not going to happen. Ben controls when pick up happens. He calls the carrier with a request for pickup, the carrier gives him a day (if during the week usually the next day) and approximate time. In 35 years doing shipping and receiving for the same company (including large shipments) I never, not once, had a carrier not show up on the date promised. That included UPS, FedX, CF, at all levels of service.

A good example of KS creator communication is the Intrepid 4x5 project. A little over a month ago the creator promised an update every Friday. For the last month he has held to that promise. Although his project has slipped to 7 months past initial reward estimate you just don't see the backers complaining. When Ben posted that bit of information I did not see one sour remark from anyone, just 'thank you'.