Ok, so I tried developing 4x5 black and white sheet film today in trays for the first time. It went ok, but I have what I believe are some serious "surge marks."
Basically, super swirly density changes.
Can anyone give me some advice? I assume that the "surge" is due to an agitation problem. I "rocked" the tray every 30 seconds (basically, I lifted one edge of the tray a little so the developer and fix would move around).
Should I not agitate the film at all?
I think I'm agitating in more or less the same way as you and not getting any surge marks so I can't see that being the cause.
Should you be agitating? Probably yes, unless you've got it set up for stand development.
Can you scan in and show us what you're getting in your development?
12 rocks a minute is optimum. You might be having the opposite of surge marks, you might have bromide streaking or some other artifact of insufficient agitation.
So what are surge marks caused by?
I always thought surge marks were from tank processing in hangars (or Nikor tank processing from that dagnabit center spiral)...
Here's some relevant excerpts from "Todd-Zakia"... When reaction products on or near the emulsion surface are ineffectively swept away, a variety of nonuniformities can result.
Bromide streaks are streamers of abnormally low densities which extend away (downstream) from a high density area... Developer streaks are the converse situation... high density away downstream from a low density area... Directional effects, as in a continuous processor... {skip this since it's irrelevant}
Development mottle, most noticeable in areas of uniform density, usually occurs in tray processing when agitation is poor. Localized eddy currents concentrate, rather than disperse, the reaction products.
ckpj99, agitation every thirty seconds is fine for a sheet of film. It's what I do. When I need to develop just one or two sheet, I use a 5x7 tray. I lift one end and then the other end, say short end and then long end. Or I lift it up by one corner, then another corner. The times that I got patterns is when I touched the film during the development process. I made my own slosher, and that's done a good job for me.
"It's the way to educate your eyes. Stare. Pry, listen, eavesdrop. Die knowing something. You are not here long." - Walker Evans
How many sheets were you developing at one time? I usually did 6 at a time, and every 5 seconds I would take the bottom negative up to the top. That way every 30 seconds each sheet of film would be evenly developed. You can add more sheets at a time with practice. I read that method in one of those Ansel Adams books, I think it was the negative. Works perfectly every time.
In trays I constantly aggitate, lifting up a different corner or side twice every 10 seconds or so. One sheet in a tray at least one size bigger than the film. Once every 30 seconds sounds like too little, unless one is stand developing -- then once every 30 sec is too much. Emulsion up, and I like to hear the sheet of film whack against the side of the tray! LOL!
Ok, first off, I think someone hit the nail on the head. I was treating the film like paper. My hands were definitely on it. I'll fix that next time.
Second, I don't think I was agitating enough.
Third, I have no clue if the emulsion was up or down.
Finally, I have one last question. If I remember correctly from college, you're supposed to agitate constantly when you're film is the fix right (this applies to rolls as well)?
I always handle my film in trays; no problems with marks or streaks from that. I dislike tray rocking as an agitation method, and have always advised against it, but have been convinced lately that it can be a viable agitation method if done correctly. This involves tipping the tray enough so that the developer runs to one end/corner of the tray and mixes, thus mixing the spent developer with fresh. Agitation should also be vigorous enough to dislodge the thin layer of exhausted developer on the film's surface and replace it with fresh.
FWIW, I shuffle several sheets of film at a time in the tray, taking a sheet from the bottom of the stack, lifting it completely out of the developer and then replacing it on the top of the stack. I go through my stack once every 30 seconds, regardless of the number of sheets (e.g., one shuffle every five seconds for six sheets, one every ten seconds for three sheets, etc.). When I just develop one sheet, I lift it from the developer, turn it 180° and place it back into the developer every 15 seconds. I push the sheet down into the developer gently with the balls of my fingers (no marks).
As for the streaks, I would suggest that your agitation is inadequate and recommend more vigorous rocking, if you want to stick with that as an agitation method. Also, try a you pre-soak, since this promotes more even developing. And, make sure you are developing your film emulsion-side up in the tray, especially if you are only rocking the tray to agitate.
I would encourage you to handle your film more as well. Once you master shuffling, you will be able to do more than one sheet at a time, greatly reducing your time spent developing.
There are a ton of threads here on tray developing that a search or two should turn up.
Best,
Doremus Scudder
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