Mount a Goerz Apochromat Red Dot Artar 19" in shutter

[ThePenguin]

Is it possible to mount this lens in a shutter? I've heard that it would work in a Copal 3 or a Ilex 4. I've never mounted a lens in a shutter before, is it hard work? Is it even possible to do it by your self?

[Graybeard]

You can front mount this lens nicely on an Alphax or Ilex #4 (even an Ilex #3 with a slight loss in movements).

If you have acess to a thread cutting lathe its a pretty straightforward job - just making a threaded bushing. S K Grimes does this for about $85.

Is it possible to mount this lens in a shutter? I've heard that it would work in a Copal 3 or a Ilex 4. I've never mounted a lens in a shutter before, is it hard work? Is it even possible to do it by your self?

[ThePenguin]

So I have to modify the lens to make it work?

[Dan Fromm]

No, the unmodified lens screws into the bushing, the bushing screws into the shutter.

[ThePenguin]

So it's possible to just buy this one:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3006127172...84.m1423.l2649

and then a shutter like this one and simply mount it together without any modifications:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1706464609...84.m1423.l2649


I'm I right?

[Dan Fromm]

According to this http://www.skgrimes.com/lens-mountin...ed-to-shutters the lens' cells can be made to go into a Copal #3. Putting them in will require machining but since I haven't studied the problem I can't tell you what it is. Possibilities are threaded bushings to attach each cell to the shutter with the right spacing and rethreading the cells.

As for front-mounting, the lens' exit pupil's is approximately 44 mm in diameter. To front-mount it without loss of illumination, you'll need a shutter whose diaphragm opens to at least 44 mm. Here http://www.suaudeau.eu/memo/pratique..._centraux.html is a heap of data on shutters. It gives the impression that a Copal #3 will just do. Wider would be better to reduce the risk of vignetting.

If you go that way you'll need to have a mount adapter made (the threaded bushing that Graybeard mentioned).

I don't know how much 19"/11 RD Artars in #3 sell for, but buying one ready to shoot may cost less than buying one in barrel, a shutter, and a mount adapter. SKGrimes uses a mysterious pricing algorithm -- based on diameter and length -- for mount adapters. The one you need may cost more than the $85 Graybeard reported. Make haste slowly.

[Michael Graves]

Watch for a nice sample in an Ilex #4. They come up relatively frequently. I got a very nice one for under $400.00 about two years ago. But that was probably lower than you'll find these days.

[c.d.ewen]

Penguin:

Follow Mike Graves' advice.

Here are some visuals: to front mount a lens to a shutter, you need an adapter that has internal threads for the lens, and external threads for the shutter. Photo #1 shows these separately, and photo #2 shows them assembled into an Ilex 5 shutter (bigger then an Ilex 4). I did this because I have several Ilex 5's, but no working Ilex 4's ( separate rant ).

I don't know what method SKGrimes uses to mount a 19" RD Artar into a Copal 3, but it isn't simple. Photo #3 shows the adapter on top of a Copal 3 - the lens threads are way too big to screw into the shutter.

You could make an adapter that holds the lens way out in front of the shutter threads, but that's Dan's point about vignetting - you don't want to take pictures looking through a toilet paper tube.

Front mounting isn't as demanding a machining job as some, but there are still several factors that can make it undesirable. Photo #4 shows the back end of the lens and adapter. Note that the lens extends well into the adapter. This puts it close to the shutter blades, without interfering with them. The adapter extends beyond the bottom of the lens, so that when you stand the pair up, they sit on the adapter, not the lens. Also, even with the lens screwed deep into the adapter, there's still enough room above to allow for a flange to grasp in order to screw the adapter into the shutter.

Charley

[Graybeard]

"If you go that way you'll need to have a mount adapter made (the threaded bushing that Graybeard mentioned).

I don't know how much 19"/11 RD Artars in #3 sell for, but buying one ready to shoot may cost less than buying one in barrel, a shutter, and a mount adapter. SKGrimes uses a mysterious pricing algorithm -- based on diameter and length -- for mount adapters. The one you need may cost more than the $85 Graybeard reported. Make haste slowly.[/QUOTE]"

The $85 is what I paid earlier this year for a front mount bushing to fit a 19" Artar onto an Alphax #4. The Grimes bushing is a nice close fit and minimizes any vignetting within the shutter body.

A Copal #3 is an expensive purchase, even used. The Ilex and Alphax #4's can often be had for $75-100. Which shutter is appropriate for you will depend on how you plan to use the 19" Artar.

If you plan to use the lens on a 4x5 then a #4 shutter front mount may serve you well. The 19" Artar that I have in the Alphax #4 covers 8x10 easily and allows about 75% of the front swing on my Deardorff. An image circle this large would seem adequate for quite a lot of movement on a 4x5 field camera and pretty decent on a 5x7.

[E. von Hoegh]

There's one in the FS section.