Help Wanted: Camera with wide-angle lens to re-photograph 1920s Postcards

[MKVII]

Using my 6.5x9 Voigtländer Bergheil, I've been re-photographing 1920s postcards in my hometown. I've achieved good results, but unfortunately, many postcards seem to have been shot with a shorter lens than the 10.5cm Heliar on my camera. Because I aim to re-photograph 1920s postcards with equally old equipment, I've been unsuccessfully searching for a 6x9 camera from that era with a wider lens. Unless someone here knows of such a camera, I'll probably have to switch to large format cameras as they do have wide-angle lenses available. Moreover, they offer the advantage of perspective correction, something the photographers of my postcards also seem to have used.

Ideally, I'd like to purchase a camera-lens combination that was popular among postcard photographers in the 1920s. However, that's easier said than done. Even with the names of well-known postcard photographers, I've struggled to trace their equipment. Does anyone here perhaps have a tip?

However, even without a tip, it might be possible to deduce the equipment used a hundred years ago for postcards. Judging from the postcards I have, the photos were taken with a focal length between 40mm and 35mm (35mm equivalent). Based on research in this forum, I believe a Graflex camera with a 127mm lens could be a good candidate? It's a popular professional camera with a wide-angle lens in that range.

Am I on the right track? All advice is welcome!

[Greg]

Pursued a similar project maybe 15 years ago of reshooting postcards made 100 plus years ago. Fortunately I am the Curator for our town's Historical Museum and had access to some of the original glass plates and photo equipment used. Two local photographers back then shot with 5x7 inch glass plates. Final images were just 3 1/2 x 5 1/2 inch crops. Even though most of the WA images were shot with a lens that didn't fully cover the 5x7 glass plates, especially when the rise of the front standard was used, it didn't matter because cropped final images were used.

[Dan Fromm]

OP, are you photographing postcards or scenes shown in postcards? I find it hard to believe that you're copying postcards with a Bergheil.

Are you shooting sheet film or roll film with your Bergheil?

Few 6x9 (in Imperial, 2.25 x 3.25 inches) camera from the 1920s had shorter lenses than normal. And, for that matter, there were few wide angle lenses for 6x9 cameras in those days.

FWIW, the normal lens for 24x36 (that's 35mm still) is 43 mm. The normal lens for 2x3 is 100 mm. The 6x9 lens equivalent to a 35 mm lens on 24x36 is 81 mm. There are many ~ 80 mm lenses in shutter that can be used on, for example, a Century Graphic. Also in barrel that can be used on, for example, a 2x3 Speed Graphic. They're probably harder to find and more expensive than you'd like, but they exist.

About the "vintage" look. That's more a consequence of aging (photographic prints, picture postcards), emulsions used to shoot the original negatives and make prits, and exposure (taking and printing) than of the lenses used.

You mentioned trying a Graflex. Graflex' terminology is very confusing and it got you. Graflex is a company and a series of cameras. Graflex made several ranges of cameras. Graflex SLRs; Graphics, mainly but not all press type; Graphic View, view cameras as the name indicates; Century, more view cameras. To add to the fun, the Century Graphic I mentioned is a plastic-bodied version of the 2x3 Pacemaker Crown Graphic, itself a version of the Pacemaker Speed Graphic without a focal plane shutter. Are you confused yet? You should be. Of interest to your project, there are no wide angle lenses for Graflex SLRs. There are w/a lenses that will work on the others.

To confuse you further, I have a Century Graphic and 2 2x3 Crown Graphics, with 35, 38, 45, 47, 58, 60, 65, 75, 80, 85, 100, ... lenses that work on them. All but the 38, a 38/4.5 Biogon, cover 2x3. Lenses that will do what you want are out there.

[MKVII]

Pursued a similar project maybe 15 years ago of reshooting postcards made 100 plus years ago. Fortunately I am the Curator for our town's Historical Museum and had access to some of the original glass plates and photo equipment used. Two local photographers back then shot with 5x7 inch glass plates. Final images were just 3 1/2 x 5 1/2 inch crops. Even though most of the WA images were shot with a lens that didn't fully cover the 5x7 glass plates, especially when the rise of the front standard was used, it didn't matter because cropped final images were used.

Thanks Greg for this answer. Reshooting antique photos with the same photo equipment is a dream to me. Keeping everything the same except time that has passed between the original and new photograph.

A couple more questions if I may:
- what was the brand and type of the camera you used?
- what was the focal length of the lens of the camera you used?
- was only the rise of the front standard used or other movements too?
- any other tips or information which I shoud take into consideration?

Thanks in advance!

[xkaes]

Depending on your camera -- which I am not familiar with -- to get shorter focal length lenses -- all you need are "close-up filters". I know that sounds odd, but it's true -- really easy, and inexpensive. Here are the details:

http://www.subclub.org/fujinon/close-up.htm

[MKVII]

OP, are you photographing postcards or scenes shown in postcards? I find it hard to believe that you're copying postcards with a Bergheil.

Are you shooting sheet film or roll film with your Bergheil?

Few 6x9 (in Imperial, 2.25 x 3.25 inches) camera from the 1920s had shorter lenses than normal. And, for that matter, there were few wide angle lenses for 6x9 cameras in those days.

FWIW, the normal lens for 24x36 (that's 35mm still) is 43 mm. The normal lens for 2x3 is 100 mm. The 6x9 lens equivalent to a 35 mm lens on 24x36 is 81 mm. There are many ~ 80 mm lenses in shutter that can be used on, for example, a Century Graphic. Also in barrel that can be used on, for example, a 2x3 Speed Graphic. They're probably harder to find and more expensive than you'd like, but they exist.

About the "vintage" look. That's more a consequence of aging (photographic prints, picture postcards), emulsions used to shoot the original negatives and make prits, and exposure (taking and printing) than of the lenses used.

You mentioned trying a Graflex. Graflex' terminology is very confusing and it got you. Graflex is a company and a series of cameras. Graflex made several ranges of cameras. Graflex SLRs; Graphics, mainly but not all press type; Graphic View, view cameras as the name indicates; Century, more view cameras. To add to the fun, the Century Graphic I mentioned is a plastic-bodied version of the 2x3 Pacemaker Crown Graphic, itself a version of the Pacemaker Speed Graphic without a focal plane shutter. Are you confused yet? You should be. Of interest to your project, there are no wide angle lenses for Graflex SLRs. There are w/a lenses that will work on the others.

To confuse you further, I have a Century Graphic and 2 2x3 Crown Graphics, with 35, 38, 45, 47, 58, 60, 65, 75, 80, 85, 100, ... lenses that work on them. All but the 38, a 38/4.5 Biogon, cover 2x3. Lenses that will do what you want are out there.

Thank you Dan! To answer your questions first: I shoot the same scenes as depicted on the postcards from the same angle and in the same season/weather conditions. In many cases I can recreate the exact same image with my Bergheil, except for the postcards which were shot with a wide-angle lens. I use a RADA film back with 120 roll film which works fine for me. With Ilford Ortho Plus I get results with the same look as the 100 year old postcards. If only Voigtländer had made wide-angle lenses for the Bergheil...

You've got a nice collection of lenses! From your answer I get that I have to read up on Graflex and the ranges of cameras they made. I hope there's a model from the 1920s of the view camera type with a nice wide-angle lens of the same era and the possibility of attaching a filmback.

[Greg]

A couple more questions if I may:

- what was the brand and type of the camera you used?
Initially I had planned on using a 5x7 Sinar Norma and shooting black & white negatives, but color digital files and color final images were requested, so I had to switch to shooting Digital.

- what was the focal length of the lens of the camera you used?
Since I had to shoot with a digital camera, I chose the FX format with 24mm, 28mm, 35mm, and 85mm PC lenses.

- was only the rise of the front standard used or other movements too?
Pretty much only rise was used. Almost all the images were shot on a tripod to exactly match the original post cards. Exceptions were the images that had to be shot in the middle of the road... Roads are a lot busier than 100+ years ago.

- any other tips or information which I should take into consideration?
First off my choice would be to shoot black & white film and hand color the prints to match the vintage colored postcards.
Even though shooting FX color could have been done with a hand held camera, I totally chose to use a tripod and compose as I would using a view camera. Also chose not to use the eyepiece finder but the rear LCD monitor/image display.
If shooting the same subjects today I would use the same PC lenses with a FUJIFILM GFX tethered to an iPad.

Good luck and enjoy shooting those "antique photos"

[AuditorOne]

Graflex made 2x3 Graflex and Speed Graphic cameras that easily accommodated different, interchangeable lenses.

[MKVII]

Depending on your camera -- which I am not familiar with -- to get shorter focal length lenses -- all you need are "close-up filters". I know that sounds odd, but it's true -- really easy, and inexpensive. Here are the details:

http://www.subclub.org/fujinon/close-up.htm

Thanks Xkaes! The project calls for authentic lenses so only if I could find a matching close-up filter made a hundred years ago, I can use it.

[Dan Fromm]

Thank you Dan! To answer your questions first: I shoot the same scenes as depicted on the postcards from the same angle and in the same season/weather conditions. In many cases I can recreate the exact same image with my Bergheil, except for the postcards which were shot with a wide-angle lens. I use a RADA film back with 120 roll film which works fine for me. With Ilford Ortho Plus I get results with the same look as the 100 year old postcards. If only Voigtländer had made wide-angle lenses for the Bergheil...

You've got a nice collection of lenses! From your answer I get that I have to read up on Graflex and the ranges of cameras they made. I hope there's a model from the 1920s of the view camera type with a nice wide-angle lens of the same era and the possibility of attaching a filmback.

Thanks for the explanation. There's no good reason except personal preference to use an old camera. Remember that the camera's sole purpose is to keep the light out. The lens forms the image, the shutter times the exposure, the sensitive surface (film, silicon, makes no difference) captures the image.

It seems to me that you want a camera that accepts a 2x3 (6x9 in metric, not 6.5x9, which is a sheet film format) 120 roll holder and interchangeable lenses. I mentioned Graphics because that's what I mainly use. I like mine but the only useful movement they have is front rise, which I use to correct converging verticals and, sometimes, to eliminate the foreground. If you want to go Graphic, Graflex made only 4 2x3 models. Miniature Speed Graphic, Pacemaker Speed Graphic, Pacemaker Crown Graphic and Century Graphic are the official names. The Century and 2x3 Crown are better for w/a lenses than the 2x3 Speeds. People refer to all 4 as mini and baby Graphics. Confusing. I've had them all, wouldn't have a Miniature Speed Graphic again. To learn more about Graflex' products, go to graflex.org and root around. The forum has little traffic these days but questions posted there are usually answered promptly.

You might be better off with a more capable 2x3 camera. Which one makes sense for you depends on where you are and your budget.

There are 2x3 monorail view cameras, I have 2 1/2 Cambo SC1s. There are others. All are a little scarce and generally not cheap. If budget matters a used 4x5 view camera that accepts 2x3 roll holders and can focus shortish lenses, say 65 mm, is probably a better bet.