45% Humidity and Ilford FB Still Won't Dry Flat

[ASA1000]

[QUOTE=Drew Wiley;1676020]... And yes, excess waviness on the leading edge of the paper, facing the opening in the inner plastic bag, /QUOTE]

I had thought that too, with 8x10 paper, which curls on the narrow side but the 11x14's long side is my problem edge and that's not facing the opening in the inner bag. and the two boxes of 11x14 I've been into so far were both ordered months apart and the batch numbers are way different on the back. Another interesting thing to me, at least, is that this new MGFB paper can sit in a try for (so far) 3 days and the emulsion is still stuck like glue to the paper. In my past experience the emulsion would float off in 3 days. Maybe that's because there are now 3 emulsion layers in MG? I dunnknow, but all this 'new and improved' stuff is sure hard to make work! ;-). Thx!

[Drew Wiley]

The nature of the gelatin on some of the newer MG Ilford papers in an intriguing question. MG Classic and Cooltone have a shinier gelatin which behaves differently from the surface on MGWT or old MGIV. It somewhat resembles the shiny gelatin on the old EMaks graded paper I'm still printing on, alleged to be pig rather than bovine derived, and also fussy (but beautiful). I've never contacted Ilford with a question about this. I did have a more serious issue with early batches of these new papers where seeming voids or freckles in outers sheets in contact with the liner bags seems to have been due to contamination on those bags themselves. I haven't had the same problem recently.

Cooltone and MGWT do not to be thoroughly immersed and agitated in each respective tray bath exceptionally quickly and evenly compared to other papers, or you might get perceptible unevenness or streaks in highlight areas like skies. EMaks is even fussier in this respect. Nonetheless, the tonal response of these newer papers perform way better
better in terms of linearity and toning qualities than MGIV ever did. But MGWT and Bergger VC's (which Harman also makes) don't have the same issues, but, of course, also carry a higher price.

I'm still a bit mystified about the wrinkling problem per se. So far I've only experienced that on really old papers - either old inventory of Galerie graded or really old leftovers in my own lab, left inside paper safes, or in partially used sleeves up on a shelf. The topic of gelatin emulsions in relation to this is very complex, and way over my head. But I do know that these gelatin layers can age differentially if unevenly exposed to atmospheric conditions over a period of time, and hence exaggerate the curling effect between emulsion side and paper substrate side. Ironically, people who hand coat watercolor papers with Pt/Pd etc often like a "deckle edge" full perimeter - but that's an entirely different look. It's horrendous where glossy gelatin is involved.

[Tin Can]

Way back in modern Catholic art school 25 years ago

The Print Maker had the young women and all fancy paper was torn, never cut

Many of us posed naked when the model canceled

I am proud to say my penis did not drip, like the Pro, that freaked us all...

Prints are difficult

LIE HATE 1997 2 of 6 by TIN CAN COLLEGE, on Flickr

[ASA1000]

My wife was ironing and commented how shirts need to be wetter here in Colorado where she irons them, than in Florida, to get them flat. Hmmmm.......
I had tried putting prints in the press while still wet to the touch but, as expected, they stuck to the overlay so I moved away from that theory. That may have been the wrong move. Yesterday with 27% humidity in the basement, I went back to putting prints that were less dry in the press. My old procedure was 45 seconds at 180, then open the press, shake the cover paper to let the moisture out and then close the press for another 30 sec. I tried different shorter times and it turns out that if I set my timer for 2 hours and 30 minutes after I put the print on the screen, and take it to the press at 2.5 hours and do the 45 and 30 procedure, and then put the print between 1/4-inch glass to cool, the edges look NORMAL! I've got 4 in a row so far! I have a video, you can see how the long edges dry differently, but if I get them in the press before they get TOO DRY I can make them flat. I'll try to post the video this evening. If this procedure continues to work (I'm still not ruling out inconsistent paper) but if it continues to work, this will mean I have flat prints in two and a half hours! That would be a DOUBLE WIN!.... could be.... maybe.

[ASA1000]

Tin Can..., you sick basstard... LOL!!

[Mark Sampson]

ASA1000, take the success. Glad you could find an answer; photography is full of frustrations, and that one has been particularly annoying.
"Endeavor to persevere"!

[Tin Can]

I guess you have not been to art school

We all get naked, that's the fun part

First day first hour of a 5 hour body movement class in SAIC Grad School

I was quickly naked and nobody else was

I had been assigned by another student to pose climbing MT Everest

I was frozen face down nude

This was 25 years ago, I miss art school

Do you know the famous reference?

AJ Nude Decending Stairs by TIN CAN COLLEGE, on Flickr

Tin Can..., you sick basstard... LOL!!

[ASA1000]

Yes I know it: 'When we dont learn from our mistakes we are destined to repeat them'............. that one?

[ASA1000]

Here's a video I put on my You Tube Channel about the process I use and my way of figuring this out:

[Greg]

My darkroom has a pretty much constant humidity level of around 50%. I dry my FB prints on screens face down overnight and they pretty much always have some curl to them. Then I usually place four of them in multiple layers between sheets of 2 ply archival board. Put them in my Seal dry mount press in the evening with the temperature set at 180 degrees. Once the press gets up to 180 degrees, I turn it off and leave the prints in the press overnight. Come the next day, the prints are just plain flat.... QED