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Thread: Using Schneider Kreuznach’s Super-Symmar XL 150mm Lens

  1. #21

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    Re: Using Schneider Kreuznach’s Super-Symmar XL 150mm Lens

    Hello r.e. Just for your reference,

    I recently purchased 4 flat copal 0 arca swiss 171mm lensboards from S.K.Grimes.
    Adam and Joel charged me 140USD for each plus shipping to Tokyo. These are not recessed and
    I needed the flat ones for fast long petzval lenses that couldn’t be mounted on 141mm lensboards.

    https://skgrimes.com/products/lens-boards/#arca

    Also for 171mm front standard 8x10 bellows, Keith of custom bellows in UK made me an extra long 80cm custom arca swiss bellows for 220GBP plus shipping.

    You can send your frames and Keith will refit to new bellows for you.

    http://www.custombellows.co.uk/

    I also have the same problem as you describe for ssxl 150mm with the center filter.
    I’m thinking to buy a used SW150 mark I filter holder and then buy a custom made adapter ring to join the holder on the center filter.

    I hope the information helps you.
    Last edited by mhayashi; 12-Jan-2022 at 13:38.

  2. #22

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    Re: Using Schneider Kreuznach’s Super-Symmar XL 150mm Lens

    Hi mhayashi,

    Thanks for suggesting S.K. Grimes as a source for a 171 flat lens board. If I go the off-centre route, I could purchase the board from Grimes and ask them to drill a Copal #1 off-centre at the same time.

    Custom Bellows is said to do excellent work, but as you say I'd have to supply the frames. I might ask Grimes what it would want to make them.

    I assume that you've seen the response that I got from Lee Filters (post #12) about a custom adapter ring for the SW150 holder. I'd like to stay in touch with you on this question since we may adopt the same solution. I've sent you a personal message with my e-mail address.

  3. #23

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    Re: Using Schneider Kreuznach’s Super-Symmar XL 150mm Lens

    Quote Originally Posted by r.e. View Post
    I'm not holding my breath on coming across a 171mm 8x10 bag bellows second-hand. I know that Arca-Swiss made a 171mm 4x5 bellows for a forum participant a few months ago, but I haven't asked yet whether it will make an 8x10 or what it would cost. A Hong Kong maker wants about US$425, which is a fair bit less than what Arca-Swiss would likely want. A purchaser of a 4x5 bellows from the Hong Kong maker tells me that he thinks that his is well-made.
    Bernice Loui just received a bellows from the Hong Kong maker (eTone) and has posted this positive first impression: e-Tone Bellows for Linhof Technikardan 23s

    I also like @mhayashi's suggestion of Custom Bellows, sending them bellows frames either purchased from Arca-Swiss or made by S.K. Grimes.

    This is a photo of my camera with a 30cm rail, Arca-Swiss's 50cm 8x10 bellows and the Schneider Kreuznach Super-Symmar XL 150mm. Without taking into account the lens board's 13mm recess, there's about 225mm of bellows in this photo. When we come out of the current deep freeze, I want to get some accurate measurements of how much practical rise/fall and shift I get with this bellows with various subjects and bellows extensions. At the bellows length in the photo, I can get full rise/fall and shift. However, magnification, taking into account the lens board's 13mm recess, is about 40%, which is of limited usefulness:

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by r.e.; 17-Jan-2022 at 06:24.

  4. #24

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    Re: Using Schneider Kreuznach’s Super-Symmar XL 150mm Lens

    Further to the above post, this is a photo of the same camera and rail configured for 4x5. That's an Arca-Swiss leather bag bellows and 75mm Rodenstock Grandagon N MC. Without doubt, an 8x10 bag bellows is the best solution for the Schneider Kreuznach 150mm. It's a question of cost.




    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by r.e.; 17-Jan-2022 at 12:11.

  5. #25

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    Re: Using Schneider Kreuznach’s Super-Symmar XL 150mm Lens

    A digression... I've been asked about the tripod head in the photos in the two posts above. It's a Miller CX6 fluid head, which has a load capacity of 12kg/26.4lb. I purchased it for video, but now I also use it with my large format camera. It makes levelling, panning and tilting the camera pretty much effortless.

    These two photos are side and rear views of the CX6 supporting a Blackmagic Cinema Camera. The controls at the back set counterbalance and drag, and there's a night light.


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    The CX6 makes it possible to balance a camera so that it will pan and tilt easily and smoothly, as well as stay put when it's tilted up or down. This is easily repeatable for a given camera and lens setup. There's a wrinkle for large format cameras. A change in bellows extension will throw balance off. However, if I balance my Arca-Swiss and a given lens at infinity focus, panning and tilting the camera remains easy even if I extend the bellows further.

    In these two photos, my Blackmagic camera is not locked down. I've just used my hand to tilt it to these angles, where it will remain indefinitely.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Miller fluid heads are made in Australia. I also considered a Cartoni head, which are made in Italy, but I liked the fact that Miller has a North American office just outside New York City. If I lived on the west coast, I might well have chosen Cartoni, whose distributor is in Los Angeles. At the time, I discounted Sachtler's heads, which are made in Costa Rica, because I believed that they were nearing the end of their product life. This turned out to be correct. Buying now, I would also consider Sachtler's new fluid heads, released last year. I should note that a fluid head is probably not attractive to someone who wants minimal weight. The CX6 weighs 2.2kg/4.9lb. I see its mass as a benefit, but a backpacker might be less keen
    Last edited by r.e.; 18-Jan-2022 at 15:05.

  6. #26

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    Re: Using Schneider Kreuznach’s Super-Symmar XL 150mm Lens

    We had a break in the weather today. I took the camera out on the street and learned that I have enough rise/fall and shift, in practical photo-making situations, with the standard bellows. However, I suspect that being unable to use the camera's and lens's full range of movement the closer I get to infinity focus (150mm) will eventually become annoying. A bag bellows or off-centre lens board is probably in my future.

    As a result of an e-mail exchange and discussion with S.K. Grimes, I'm also satisfied that I can set up the centre filter to use 150mm graduated neutral density filters. A 112mm ring adapter for Lee's SW150 Holder, and a holder designed by Grimes, are both possible options, although neither is inexpensive.
    Last edited by r.e.; 19-Jan-2022 at 19:54.

  7. #27
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    Re: Using Schneider Kreuznach’s Super-Symmar XL 150mm Lens

    Quote Originally Posted by r.e. View Post
    We had a break in the weather today. I took the camera out on the street and learned that I have enough rise/fall and shift, in practical photo-making situations, with the standard bellows. However, I suspect that being unable to use the camera's and lens's full range of movement the closer I get to infinity focus (150mm) will eventually become annoying. A bag bellows or off-centre lens board is probably in my future.

    As a result of an e-mail exchange and discussion with S.K. Grimes, I'm also satisfied that I can set up the centre filter to use 150mm graduated neutral density filters. A 112mm ring adapter for Lee's SW150 Holder, and a holder designed by Grimes, are both possible options, although neither is inexpensive.
    I was browsing through your previous posts and noticed that you had already contacted LEE regarding the filter holder, but what surprised me was that they didn't mention their own 115mm push on holder. It fits the Schneider IVa center filter perfectly and can be used with 2 stacked rectangular filters without vignetting when no movements are applied (perhaps that's the reason it is not applicable to you situation?).

  8. #28

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    Re: Using Schneider Kreuznach’s Super-Symmar XL 150mm Lens

    Quote Originally Posted by Beano_z View Post
    I was browsing through your previous posts and noticed that you had already contacted LEE regarding the filter holder, but what surprised me was that they didn't mention their own 115mm push on holder. It fits the Schneider IVa center filter perfectly and can be used with 2 stacked rectangular filters without vignetting when no movements are applied (perhaps that's the reason it is not applicable to you situation?).
    Hi Beano. As you know, the 115mm push-on holder takes Lee's 100mm filters. Are you saying that you've tried Schneider's 150mm XL lens and IVa centre filter with this holder and 100mm filters, and found that there was no vignetting when the camera is zeroed? If so, thanks, that's extremely helpful to know. I wondered (post #12) whether one might be able to get away with a filter less than 112mm across, but haven't had a way to test it.

    I was dealing with Lee in California, and as far as I can tell this push-on holder is no longer sold in the U.S. It may be available in the U.K. Robert White doesn't appear to list it, but Linhof Studio may have it (see below, requires a stock inquiry); and of course it can be purchased second-hand.

    Lee 115mm Push-on Holder

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    Last edited by r.e.; 28-Feb-2022 at 07:01.

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