I once returned an item that was worth around $30 paid without Paypal. The seller said he never got it. BS. I just chalked it up to a lesson learned. This is the reason I won't sell or buy big ticket items on ebay. Too much of a hassle. I've bought stuff but have limited it to let's say a hundred dollars. Also, I check the seller's rating to make sure it's 99% positive.Originally Posted by Audii-Dudii
Flickr Home Page: https://www.flickr.com/photos/alanklein2000/albums
Of course they wouldn't refuse, because you'll have no recourse if there's a problem after the sale. And the seller doesn't pay any fees.
But you're missing the point. OP's buyers don't want to use cash; they want to use PayPal, because they want the protection afforded by PayPal. And OP never mentioned switching to "PayPal only".
So I don't see how your practices help the OP, when they clearly state they have buyers walking away because PayPal isn't an option.
The most interesting sale I made was to an English speaking citizen in Japan. He sent to my home by registered mail USA cold cash. (Maybe it was Certified mail, or both. Can't remember)
I have used Paypal since its inception for selling musical instruments. I never had a problem because I was willing to take a loss and asked for the instrument back in case the customer was not satisfied. I had no problem at all. I did have problems trying to collect insurance for damaged goods during transportation (USPS, FedEX.). I have also bought everything related to photography for the last 15 years paying with Paypal. They have become very pro-buyer. I have had two cases where the shutter of the lens "sounds good to my ears" did not sound good to mine and I had to send it to CLA. In one case, the Japanese seller paid for the whole CLA, and in other case, the seller asked the lens in return and paid for the shipping. However, he put be in the "black list", he blocked me from buying from him. I have not sold recently, but I buy all the time. Sometimes, I get screwed up, but the item is so small that I rather lose the money rather than spend time challenging and sending stuff back. I found that selling in forums where they know you is easier because usually we have the same interests and kind of know each other through the postings. That being said, I will be selling my collection of seven Leicas/lenses to start paying for $8/sheet of 8x10. ;(
"I have never in my life made music for money or fame. God walks out of the room when you are thinking about money." -- Quincy Jones
There was a time when every town big enough for 2 stoplights had lots of buyers and sellers - private and commercial - for analog gear. Now, most of the time, we rely on forums such as this or ebay. If you limit yourself to "in person" deals, you severely restrict your options. For all it's faults, paypal is an essential lubricant for these transactions. It's interesting to note that no significant competitor to paypal has arisen.
As a buyer there are many advantages to using PayPal. And therefore most people buying on the internet do expect it as you mentioned. I personally do not buy without PayPal. I have had many legit not as described returns in my favor such as stuck shutters and lens fungus where I got my money back because of the buyer security of PayPal. Because of this I do sell with PayPal because it specifically opens you up to more buyers. And with more buyers comes higher prices to sell at. I have sold quite a few cameras that would get no local buyers but when I go online and accept PayPal I get way more interest even from international buyers who btw wouldn’t send me US dollars on the mail.
The main downside is that of course for sellers you are losing a bit in fees, but when I can sell my Alpa Reflex Model 6 for 500 dollars more to an international buyer because I accept PayPal it kind of works out.
I have sold dozens of camera online using PayPal and have yet to be scammed. I’m sure it will happen one day.
I used to be an Ebay Seller of film photography gear. I've sold a ton of stuff. Buyers trust PayPal with good reason. I've never had any problem with it myself as a Seller. It has come in handy a couple times as a Buyer!
Yes, I think you should join PayPal, and maybe Venmo too. I participate in this forum as an enthusiastic photographer curious about film and large format, but I depend on Paypal for my business as a Rolleiflex dealer. I would say about half of my customers use Paypal to pay for orders. Since most credit cards offer cash back on purchases, I can only guess they use paypal because they feel safer doing so. I think paypal fees are higher than they need to be, but still the convenience is worth it. As a business, I negotiate different rates but basically just accept them as part of doing business.
As a LFPF member, mostly I am buying and I don't have a problem sending money with paypal. Most private sellers just ask for the fee's to split fee's and I'm ok with that - it's the norm. But if a seller expected me to go get a cashiers check? no deal, just don't have time. Same goes for meeting up in person with cash - it's often fun to meet other photographers when I have time, but ...
btw - there was an article in the NYTimes recently written by a 14 year old that was very interesting - most of his friends used venmo or cash app and much preferred that to having cash.
IDK John. When I asked someone that same question back in 1999 I did without hesitation. I have used it for hundreds of transactions as a buyer and seller without issue. I have bought and sold things to people on the continental USA as well as overseas, never had an issue. And a few years ago Paypal started paying for return shipping if there is an issue and something needs to be returned ( wrong size something or whatever ). This was especially helpful when a beautiful blue dress was purchased off of Amazon for 10$ and it wasn't the right size so it was returned to China. It was required to be shipped back registered mail which cost something like $60, and it was free. Recently something similar happened, I purchased a used canvas field coat and it didn't quite fit, and return freight was covered.
THAT SUX !
Alpenhaus, a camera maker/polaroid converter had a similar problem. Scammer had PP refund.
Warning: NEVER even mention PP to him you will be sorry you did.
I have been selling online since I was about 15 - started on eBay, receiving Money Orders shipped to me from all corners of the globe. Back then I was selling collectibles / trading cards with my dad.
As soon as PayPal was a thing we joined up. Forging MOs had just started to be a problem.
PayPal has its problems, as does any system. But it's still basically the most universally-accepted online payment service out there and buyers trust it. Yes, this is because it is easy to get a PayPal refund.
I have had a few issues with PayPal. One was an outright scam, and the other one or two were grumpy buyers wanting a refund. And yes, one of them returned a damaged camera. After discussing with PayPal and emailing them a quote on the damage, they gave me some money to pay for the repair. So they did, at that time, both honor their Buyer and Seller protection clauses. This was quite a number of years ago though. And by the way, I resold the damaged camera instead of repairing it and ended up getting more than the original sale on eBay (the original sale was not on eBay). So I made out quite well in the end.
Accepting only Money Orders is a risk for the buyer. Not accepting PayPal is basically saying you don't want any risk and that risk must be assumed by the buyer. Of course one can rationalize this as "I am a trustworthy person" but that doesn't mean much to anyone else!
Personally I think there is way too much online whining about PayPal. Sure, there will be issues here and there, but out of literally thousands of transactions I have had only maybe 3-4 problems. A lot of my sales/purchases nowadays if I know the person somewhat, such as posters on this forum, I will gladly pay via "Friends" payments to avoid fees and many do the same for me. The occasional horror story of someone whose first sale went south is an outlier, not the norm.
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