Results with long expired transparency film + America's 60th national park

[Pfsor]

But IMHO if you unseal the film without even moving it out of the freezer then the degradation should start because oxygen in contact, I guess.

Color film is sold well sealed, a reason may be there.

Then why is sealed film kept in a fridge in order to let it last? It is the temperature that has its role in its longevity, not just the sealing!

[esearing]

I'll play devils advocate. Did you really save money? You spent $x back in 1999 and have had to pay for the electricity to store the film which gives you $X+$Y + time and energy for potential disappointment. Film is not an appreciating asset to the point we should all run out and buy a bunch and hold it for 10 years and wait for a market increase to cash in. If you had only bought only the amount film you would actually use in a year, and invest the difference how much film could you buy today?

I understand that this film is no longer made, but there are other materials available each year which may require one to adapt. Will your aesthetic tastes change in the multiple decades you hold onto that old film?

[Pere Casals]

Then why is sealed film kept in a fridge in order to let it last? It is the temperature that has its role in its longevity, not just the sealing!

No doubt, slide film has to be frozen for long term preservation, just guessing that if we warm it up and we freeze it again then the degradation process won't start, but also guessing that by opening seal while always frozen then the degradation process will start, even if film has not been warmed up.

I'll play devils advocate. Did you really save money? You spent $x back in 1999 and have had to pay for the electricity to store the film which gives you $X+$Y + time and energy for potential disappointment. Film is not an appreciating asset to the point we should all run out and buy a bunch and hold it for 10 years and wait for a market increase to cash in. If you had only bought only the amount film you would actually use in a year, and invest the difference how much film could you buy today?
I understand that this film is no longer made, but there are other materials available each year which may require one to adapt. Will your aesthetic tastes change in the multiple decades you hold onto that old film?

In present situation it is important to understand well how to preserve Velvia/Provia. One of this days Fuji may discontinue an slide product or LF format, it would be painful for a kind of photography, we don't know if it can happen soon, but we have seen what happened to Acros LF. So it is important to know that unsealed film should be used propmtly, even if frozen.

[QT Luong]

Sorry, QTLuong, can you explain? What repeatable results are you talking about? You took old film out of the freezer and took some pictures that were good. But the very same old film, just after being cut and put back to the freezer was not good. So how long the time out of the freezer makes the film going bad? The time you cut it and put back to the freezer, or the time you use it out of the freezer in your camera? What was repeatable there? You repeatably took old film out of the freezer and it was good but was not good when you just interrupted the freezing cycle without taking pics? It's all clear like mud.

What was repeatable was that unopened, frozen film gave good results regarding of film expiration date so far.

[QT Luong]

I'll play devils advocate. Did you really save money? You spent $x back in 1999 and have had to pay for the electricity to store the film which gives you $X+$Y + time and energy for potential disappointment. Film is not an appreciating asset to the point we should all run out and buy a bunch and hold it for 10 years and wait for a market increase to cash in. If you had only bought only the amount film you would actually use in a year, and invest the difference how much film could you buy today?

I understand that this film is no longer made, but there are other materials available each year which may require one to adapt. Will your aesthetic tastes change in the multiple decades you hold onto that old film?

All good points. The main reason I saved money was that it was bought as expired, cold-stored film (from Freestyle is I remember) for about 20% of retail.

[Corran]

How hot was it when you had the film at Pinnacles? I've had some issues when I brought thawed Quickloads with me out on the trail. Images made that day are fine, and then unshot film returned to the freezer and used later showed degradation. My assumption is that the heat of the day caused the issue, but I'm talking about south GA / north FL with 95 degree temps and 100% humidity...

I pack less color film with me lately. Just enough to make a few images if I find something interesting.

[Pfsor]

No doubt, slide film has to be frozen for long term preservation, just guessing that if we warm it up and we freeze it again then the degradation process won't start, but also guessing that by opening seal while always frozen then the degradation process will start, even if film has not been warmed up.

According to these comments https://photo.stackexchange.com/ques...-in-the-fridge it's the temperature changes that help deteriorating the film (see the last comment). And it seems that the seal on the film is more against getting condense on it, not to avoid a contact with oxygen. See https://www.kodak.com/global/en/serv.../tib5202.shtml

[faberryman]

If you went back into an open box five years later, it doesn't sound like you shoot much, so I doubt you are actually saving much.

[Pfsor]

What was repeatable was that unsealed, frozen film gave good results regarding of film expiration date so far.

And what was also repeatable is the fact that the unsealed and refrozen film got bad.
It's like saying - I played the Russian roulette and I'm alive. You too can play it and stay alive!

How long did you have the unsealed film heated in your film holders and the camera and how long did it stay so after the exposure? There is no warranty you could give on the unfrozen film, like in the Russian roulette. On the contrary - you now know that the rest of the film gets deteriorated even if re-frozen. Why not the rest of the film that was used in the camera?
You got lucky - good for you. But from there going to say - it's ok, the roulette played with the old film - it is not too a logical step, it seems to me. That's how I see it.

[Pere Casals]

According to these comments https://photo.stackexchange.com/ques...-in-the-fridge it's the temperature changes that help deteriorating the film.

IMHO the low temperature preserving effect is because degradating chemical reactions become way slower. This is explained by Arrhenius equation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrhenius_equation

If it is because that then warming up the film for a short term would not make a difference, just during the periods in what film is hotter degradation will advance more, but IMHO rather than because temperature change, degradation progression would be related to the warmer periods.

And it seems that the seal on the film is more against getting condense on it, not to avoid a contact with oxygen. See https://www.kodak.com/global/en/serv.../tib5202.shtml

If single factor was humidity then unsealed film could be resealed with some silicagel, or after filling with dry air. But I guess it's not that easy. We should learn what gas Fuji/Kodak uses in the packaging, if it is bare dry air, an inert gass, or even an active gas (like it happens with hypering...). I was told that the sealed container has an specific gas inside, anyway I've no source proving it.

We have the fact that a -20ºC frozen unsealed slide film experiments degradation, can moisture at -20ºC (pure ice) be the degradation triggering factor ? IMHO oxygen is way more suspicious... It would be great to know it for sure.