Big Changes in Yosemite

[xkaes]

What I'm getting at here is the park entrance fee is in the end about the cheapest part of the trip.

While not everyone drives a $100,000 RV and uses $5,000 cameras and stays at five star hotels, the current Admin has a new idea. The President is going to visit Bear Ears and Golden Stair Case/Escalante National Monuments today(?) in order to recommend making them substantially smaller. No public input allowed, but the Sierra Club already has plans to sue. That will take years, so there is still time for anyone to visit them. Both are incredible -- and there is no entrance fee or limited access!

[Thad Gerheim]

I wonder if there could be some sort of alternative to an entrance fee though, such as maybe some hours of service to the park? I honestly wouldn't mind running a chain saw or Bobcat along a trail to help out. Kent in SD

There are some great wilderness areas out there that are free and are doing a decent job on the limited budget they have. Thanks to volunteer groups like this one http://www.selwaybitterroot.org/getinvolved/ . I volunteered with them for a month to caretake a wilderness ranger station that is located 25 miles in from the trailhead. You wouldn't be running a chainsaw or Bobcat though, it's crosscut saws, shovels, and pulaskis.

I bumped into this guy at the gas station in Stanley Idaho awhile back, he is shooting film and has taken on a big project- https://www.publiclandsproject.com/index

[xkaes]

I bumped into this guy at the gas station in Stanley Idaho awhile back, he is shooting film and has taken on a big project- https://www.publiclandsproject.com/index

Great shots!!! Coincidentally enough, his first picture is of a waterfall in the Escalante!

[stawastawa]

... I honestly wouldn't mind running a chain saw or Bobcat along a trail to help out.
Kent in SD

I almost wonder if doing some helping out should be required in order to visit.

Helping out takes a lot of logistics and full staff though too. There are many things in the US that could use better staffing.

I agree there should be more federal/state taxes going into the parks.
I don't think admission should be raised.
I would be OK with a permit system, but would hope some areas could remain drop in. (I am not a huge fan of the online Permit system, but I guess it is somewhat better than the mail). ( I also don't like that it implies having staff in a call center miles away from the park to help make the system work).
I think fines for littering should be more strictly enforced. I would be all for counting all possessions of visitors and charging a fine if something doesn't make it out (done in some parks in Asia I believe?)

Free days should be no car days. a few shuttle buses and lots of bike chaos =)

~nicholas

[John Kasaian]

This thread is degenerating into elitist cacophony. The NPS mission statement encompasses far more than just protecting the environment and the park system has been expanded, rightly or wrongly, into other areas of interest. The personnel and resources required to take care of expansion is seldom realistically been taken into account when a new addition or new park is legislated into existence. I think this puts a terrible strain on the rest of the system when national park status is bestowed on public lands as some kind of reward.
When resources cannot be protected the NPS tends make it off limits so it becomes a park with no visitors, which is contrary to the NPS' mission statement.
The biggest losers, I feel, are the Native Americans. Much of the land rightfully belongs to them and was instrumental to their culture. Now chunks of it is an amusement park for Winnebagos and Prius (what is the plural of Prius anyway?)

I know of a military reservation South of Drew that is loaded with archeological treasures. There was serious talk among the higher ups of making that part of it a National Monument. Of course there was no money to do that and being on a live fire range would have required serious environmental clean up and infrastructure. Wiser minds prevailed and the sight is buried behind a security perimeter. If would be robbers are willing to dodge both live fire, unexploded artillery, and tanks, and the MPs, well that's what it would take to earn their ill gotten booty.

Ooops, I'm getting OT. Sorry 'bout that!

[Tin Can]

Dome the cities. Ban all vehicles. Elon Musk can build high-speed tunnels and let people go in the middle of nowhere. Mandatory one month vacation until allowed back in the dome. Walk home.

Has anybody read, Divergent by VERONICA ROTH? I read the series, then found my grandchildern beat me to it. At least we could chat. Such good boys and almost old enough for the war.

[xkaes]

Ooops, I'm getting OT. Sorry 'bout that!

Not at all. You are just "degenerating into elitist cacophony".

There are lots of public lands loaded with unexploded ordinance. What in the world makes you think they could even try to do any "clean-up"? I know. You want a back country permit in the White Sands National Monument -- surrounded by the White Sands Missile Range? How about the Cabeza Prieta National Wildlife Refuge (about the size of Connecticut) -- surrounded by the Goldwater Air Force Range. I could go on. The permits are free with no limits -- oh, except you have to sign a waiver saying you won't sue Uncle Sam if you happen to get blown to bits. But I can guarantee that you will be the only one to get the pictures!

Hey, now that's a novel way to drop public land use -- just drop in several thousand unexploded bombs! That's got to be cheaper than hiring more rangers!

[Nodda Duma]

This thread is degenerating into elitist cacophony. The NPS mission statement encompasses far more than just protecting the environment and the park system has been expanded, rightly or wrongly, into other areas of interest. The personnel and resources required to take care of expansion is seldom realistically been taken into account when a new addition or new park is legislated into existence. I think this puts a terrible strain on the rest of the system when national park status is bestowed on public lands as some kind of reward.
When resources cannot be protected the NPS tends make it off limits so it becomes a park with no visitors, which is contrary to the NPS' mission statement.
The biggest losers, I feel, are the Native Americans. Much of the land rightfully belongs to them and was instrumental to their culture. Now chunks of it is an amusement park for Winnebagos and Prius (what is the plural of Prius anyway?)

I know of a military reservation South of Drew that is loaded with archeological treasures. There was serious talk among the higher ups of making that part of it a National Monument. Of course there was no money to do that and being on a live fire range would have required serious environmental clean up and infrastructure. Wiser minds prevailed and the sight is buried behind a security perimeter. If would be robbers are willing to dodge both live fire, unexploded artillery, and tanks, and the MPs, well that's what it would take to earn their ill gotten booty.

Ooops, I'm getting OT. Sorry 'bout that!

I've seen some of those archaeological treasures, having worked at said test range. Being on a government test range with controlled access *and* (as long as I've known) having long been under the auspices of people who personally take Native American heritage seriously, those archaeological sites are as well-protected as any National Park.

And yes, the cleanup costs of that test range will ensure it stays that way for a long time.

[John Kasaian]

From a trip I made a couple of months back, big changes are in the works for Yosemite. For starters the Camp 4 parking area has been repaved with asphalt and the rutted front area filled in with a rock surface eliminating all the ruts that have been there for years. Yosemite Village food court is closed for remodeling with a temporary food court set-up in the conference center. It doesn't have the selection of the former and the prices are higher (for example the bowl of Chile was $6.95 IIRC) but at least you can get your morning coffee. A new and much larger curb along Northside Drive is being installed. I exited the park the day before they were to pave the Camp 4 parking area so it, and probably the Northside Drive curb are completed.

Thomas

Back on topic. Roads and parking are big issues in the Valley as this infrastructure as much to do with visitors being able to enjoy the park. I haven't been to the Valley in the past few months and the biggest disappointment I saw was that of the two one way lanes, only one was open to private vehicles,the second was restricted to trams and park vehicles. This doubled the traffic congestion. The past couple of visits our plan was to park the car and rely on trams, and make like infantry. We long ago gave up on bikes since the only times we've observed road ...uhhh... bike rage was in Yosemite Valley and it was ugly. The trams didn't run on schedule, any schedule (imagine the mortification of the German tourists?) And when a tram did appear, most times it was fully packed. Anyway, we spent what seemed to be most of the morning just hunting down a parking space. Even so, I totally agree that far too much land in the valley is consumed by parking. Hoofing it around the Valley is pleasant enough if you know where your going (we obviously did) It take awhile longer but I don't think one should be in a hurry in Yosemite unless a bear is chasing you.

Food too expensive? Bring a picnic or if you're camping anywhere other than Curry (or whatever it's called) cook your own. There are bear boxes, grills, and Colemans since campfires are often restricted. Even if you go to the restaurants, the food (and beer) is still cheaper than at a Giants game or the Fresno District Fair.

The big stinker is raising admission. I've got a geezer pass so while I'm not personally put out by it, it is troubling that it lessens the opportunity for many to visit the National Parks that do charge admission, while elitists could care less
"Give 'em a free admission day and let the unwashed petrify in their carbon fueled traffic jams" I can imagine someone saying over their martinis at the Awahnee bar.

Cutting down on vehicle traffic in the Summer season would go a long way towards providing a better experience for park visitors and likely lessen maintenance concerns to some extent as well. I recommend YARTs http://yarts.com/ if you must go to Yosemite Valley in the Summer.

[Tin Can]

I like that Yarts plan. I will use it.