Best film holders?

[Bob Salomon]

Although, I am 'by no means' a Film Holder snob...

I recently found some really, nice NIB GRAFLEX 4x5 Cut Film Holders by...
Riteway GRAPHIC (A subsidiary of General Precision Equipment Corporation -- GPE).

They are Three (3) to the Box and they were Manufactured in Rochester, N.Y.
Most definitely, they are the 'Heaviest and most Solid' 4x5 Film Holders in my inventory.
--
It would be interesting to know... If anyone else is perhaps familiar with these 'respective' Film Holders?
*They were originally, sold to me and advertised as being 'Military Surplus' Film Holders (The box itself is labelled/dated 7/68)?
--
Thank-you!

-Tim.
________

Riteway ended up being owned by Calumet and was folded into their Fidelity/Lisco business in IL.

[Taija71A]

Thank-you, for 'Chiming-in' with that update Bob.
Greatly appreciated! Best Regards,

-Tim.
________

[Greg]

On the Chamonix holders never remove all the dark slides and then try to put then in a holder they did not come out of. The holders are custom sized to fit the dark slide they hold.

Also under the right conditions out doors they will leak light in the camera body. Most of the time the photographer does not know it is happening. Best thing to do is keep the back of the camera covered with a dark cloth when a holder is in the camera and the dark slide pulled.

The best film holder are the ones you have that work.

Based on this post, I measured the dark slides on my WP and 11x14 Chamonix holders. Each format's dark slides measured pretty much the same using a borrowed precision ruler. My holders are relatively new, so maybe Chamonix has standardized their manufacturing?

Comments welcome.

Hugo?

[AtlantaTerry]

Quite a LONG time ago I bought four NIB 4x5" sheet film holders from an eBay seller in Los Angeles. When the package arrived, I looked at the film holders and noticed that they were rivited together - something I had not seen at any time before - I own over 100 sheet film holders. The boxes clearly said the holders were made in China.

Since I was not actively shooting any large format work at the time, I set the boxes aside.

A couple years went by and I started to work with large format cameras again. So I loaded up the aforementioned sheet film holders and went out to expose some film.

What TOTAL PIECES OF JUNK! The film was quite difficult to remove from the holders prior to developing and when dried, the images were CROOKED!

After some thinking and poking around I figured out what was wrong: those damn aluminum rivets! They were not holding the two halves tight together so in traveling around, the sheets of film shifted and drifted into the gaps between the halves then got trapped there which caused both broblems: difficulty of removal and tilted images.

Some wet afternoon when I don't have anything else to do, I am going to have to drill out the rivets and reattach the halves. I am thinking the best way to do it would be to drill out the rivets on one side then pry the halves apart just a tiny bit and gently inject some glue between the halves. Then I will clamp the halves together for a couple days until I am sure the glue has set. Rinse and repeat on the rivets on the other half. After all the glue has dried, fill in the rivet holes with something opaque like black silicone.

My only question is what glue should I use? Right now I am thinking about an epoxy such as JB Weld. Would a glue made for building plastic models work better?
The glue can not be too thick because that would cause the film to move out of the image plane.

Thanks,
Terry

PS
If you are ever thinking about buying some no name Chinese 4x5" sheet film holders that are riveted together, I suggest you don't. Stick with brands you know.

[Don Dudenbostel]

I've used Riteways for fifty years in my commercial studio. I bought some new and some used and had around 75 of them. I've loaded them many hundreds of times and never had any issues. Some of the tape is getting ragged now but they're still light tight. I also had a mix of various Fidelity and Lisco up to 8x10 and can honestly say the ones with plastic slides aren't even close in quality to the Riteway. I think I had fifty 8x10 Lisco and Fdelity and many that had plastic slides cracked or chipped under commercial use.

In 8x10 I personally like the older Graflex and Eastman wooden ones if you can find ones in good condition.

I bought some new all wood holders a few years ago. I don't remember the brand but they were like ones made today. I think I bought 20 and all were warped when I received them. They were returned promptly.

[John Kasaian]

IMHO, the best don't leak light, aren't warped, register the film in focus with the ground glass, have locking ridges that jive with your camera and are easy to load. If they can be easily repaired when necessary, don't stink, and found at affordable prices, so much the better.

[LabRat]

Quite a LONG time ago I bought four NIB 4x5" sheet film holders from an eBay seller in Los Angeles. When the package arrived, I looked at the film holders and noticed that they were rivited together - something I had not seen at any time before - I own over 100 sheet film holders. The boxes clearly said the holders were made in China.

Since I was not actively shooting any large format work at the time, I set the boxes aside.

A couple years went by and I started to work with large format cameras again. So I loaded up the aforementioned sheet film holders and went out to expose some film.

What TOTAL PIECES OF JUNK! The film was quite difficult to remove from the holders prior to developing and when dried, the images were CROOKED!

After some thinking and poking around I figured out what was wrong: those damn aluminum rivets! They were not holding the two halves tight together so in traveling around, the sheets of film shifted and drifted into the gaps between the halves then got trapped there which caused both broblems: difficulty of removal and tilted images.

Some wet afternoon when I don't have anything else to do, I am going to have to drill out the rivets and reattach the halves. I am thinking the best way to do it would be to drill out the rivets on one side then pry the halves apart just a tiny bit and gently inject some glue between the halves. Then I will clamp the halves together for a couple days until I am sure the glue has set. Rinse and repeat on the rivets on the other half. After all the glue has dried, fill in the rivet holes with something opaque like black silicone.

My only question is what glue should I use? Right now I am thinking about an epoxy such as JB Weld. Would a glue made for building plastic models work better?
The glue can not be too thick because that would cause the film to move out of the image plane.

Thanks,
Terry

PS
If you are ever thinking about buying some no name Chinese 4x5" sheet film holders that are riveted together, I suggest you don't. Stick with brands you know.

Hi Terry, see you were gone for awhile, but nice to see you back!!!

As for glues, what would penetrate best and hold well would be the watery superglue (non gel)... It would penetrate the seam (without separating), wipe off the excess, and clamp overnight... Apply with a hypodermic syringe, and if it clogs, dip/wipe tip with acetone... Apply as little as possible 'cuz a little goes a long way... Remove slides first, and avoid moving part areas... Also might swell softer woods slightly... This will flow into the seam well, and harden the surrounding wood or areas well... As it dries, it can leave a haze around the areas as it outgasses, but can usually be removed with a pencil eraser or very mild abrasives...

If you have to drill out the rivets, you can insert some fine wood rods (like non tapered toothpicks) into the holes, superglue them in flush, and get some #1 tiny woodscrews from the hobby shop and screw them instead... The superglue will harden the dowels well enough to screw into them... But start a small hole in them so the screw knows where to go...

Good Luck!!!

Steve K

[Steve Sherman]

When speaking about ULF holders as in my 7x17 camera, Lotus holders makes the finest I've ever seen out of the 5-6 brands I've seen but there not cheap !!

[AtlantaTerry]

Hi Terry, see you were gone for awhile, but nice to see you back!!!

As for glues, what would penetrate best and hold well would be the watery superglue (non gel)... It would penetrate the seam (without separating), wipe off the excess, and clamp overnight... Apply with a hypodermic syringe, and if it clogs, dip/wipe tip with acetone... Apply as little as possible 'cuz a little goes a long way... Remove slides first, and avoid moving part areas... Also might swell softer woods slightly... This will flow into the seam well, and harden the surrounding wood or areas well... As it dries, it can leave a haze around the areas as it outgasses, but can usually be removed with a pencil eraser or very mild abrasives...

If you have to drill out the rivets, you can insert some fine wood rods (like non tapered toothpicks) into the holes, superglue them in flush, and get some #1 tiny woodscrews from the hobby shop and screw them instead... The superglue will harden the dowels well enough to screw into them... But start a small hole in them so the screw knows where to go...

Good Luck!!!

Steve K

Steve,

Thank you for your tips and advice.

Terry

[carylee2002]

I use grafmatics for 4x5 and a couple of wooden kodak 8x10's on my 2D.