How many water changes to wash film?

[Tin Can]

Finally, a 'Fixer affects washing comment'.

What about modern fixers?

I 'think' TF5 has distinct advantages.

[Thalmees]

Using TF4 for films.
Washing in JOBO rotary 3 cycles usually.
Amount of 1 liter for each cycle.
First cycle for just few minutes, 3-4 min.
Second wash time equals fixing time at least. 6-8min usually, according to the film.
Third wash, just repeating second wash, but with distilled water.
Regardless of any circumstances, the total wash time should exceed double fixing time.
Do not remember who's procedure I'm following,
but I remember I've settled on this maneuver after reading a lot
about the subject, including ILFORD guide lines.

[Doremus Scudder]

Finally, a 'Fixer affects washing comment'.

What about modern fixers?

I 'think' TF5 has distinct advantages.

Randy,

It's generally accepted that hardening fixers lengthen the washing time, simply due to the slowing of diffusion caused by the hardening. Alkaline fixers are also generally thought to speed washing by optimizing the diffusion. I think that PE designed TF-5 to be a pH that holds the emulsion swelling at the sweet spot for fastest washing.

Best,

Doremus

[Milton Tierney]

This is the method I wash my b&w film roll or sheet film for tray or tank.
1). 5min rinse
2) 15min soak in fresh water
3)30 min soak in fresh water
4)60 min soak in fresh water
5) 1min soak in distilled water
6) 1min in photo flo & distilled water.
7) dry
Depending on amount of film, I may use 1gal to 3gals max . I do not like to waste water, besides running water can run up the water bill fast. I've been processing my b&w's this way for about 30+ years now and never seen any issue with chemical stains, fog or emulsion shifting. The Tmax -100 and TXP-320 film I shot in the 80's still looks good today. The only test I have perform is time which is 30yrs now, so in 400 or 500 years I will need to get back to you.
Just my two cents.

[Cor]

There is actually some Kodak Literature stating that complete removal of fixer is not good..trace amounts of fixer left in film (and paper) seem to protect the silver image..now define trace amounts....

Best,

Cor

[Milton Tierney]

That's interesting

[tgtaylor]

I follow Jobo's recommendation that the number of water changes is important. After a 5 minute fix with TF5 I treat with hypo clear for 2 minutes and then wash for at least 5 minutes changing the water in the tank every 30 seconds for a total of 10 complete changes of water.In reality the total wash time is probably 8 minutes with 10 changes of water.

Thomas

[Cor]

More (perhaps too much..;-)..) on fixing here http://www.freelists.org/post/pure-s...el-Gudzinowicz

There is actually some Kodak Literature stating that complete removal of fixer is not good..trace amounts of fixer left in film (and paper) seem to protect the silver image..now define trace amounts....

Best,

Cor

[Duolab123]

Rinse for 30 seconds, hypo clear agent 90 seconds continuously agitating. 10 30 second fill and dumps or 5 minutes in rapidly flowing water @ 20C from start to finish. I use a rubber hose and insert down the column of my Jobo for roll films and the 2509n reels. The Expert tanks follow the 10 fill and dump
Mike

[schafphoto]

Hi all,

Just to add another element to the process...

I got this washing process from Jet Lowe at Heritage Documentation Programs at the National Park Service in DC. They administer the HABS, HAER, HALS documentation programs. Their standard is based on hypo tests and seeks LE500 (a life expectancy of 500 years) in cold/dry storage: 45º F and 35% Relative Humidity (negatives are stored at Fort Meade, Maryland in a specially built facility). I imagine Jack Boucher and Jet were using this for decades. If this blog is still around in 500 years somebody set a reminder to check and see if it worked. ;-)

This is Jet's reply when I asked him for his selenium-added wash times:

"Add 3oz selenium toner per gallon of your permawash solution. After fixing your film, water rinse 2 minutes, transfer to the permawash-selenium solution for 4 minutes, then 15 minutes water rinse. We used 3.5 gallon tanks in a dip and dunk manual film processing line. It was not unusual to process 200-300 sheets of 5x7 film in one day.” – Jet Lowe.




All the work I do for HABS, HAER, HALS is now washed this way with added selenium toner in the mix. I use the hanging stainless racks from CARR (4x5 or 5x7) and four small clear plastic tubs for the wash sequence.

-Schaf