Any tips for buying older/used LF lenses on the auction site?

[Simos Xenakis]

I'm shopping around for lenses and was wondering if anyone could give me some tips on what to look out for when buying a used lens online and sight unseen. I'm noticing a lot of the lenses are being sold by sellers in Japan (not sure why that is), and they often mention that the shutter "sounds good" and that there is no fungus, fog, haze, or balsam separation. However, almost every listing I've come across lists that there is some dust inside the lens that "does not affect image quality."

Okay, so I guess fungus, fog, and balsam separation is easy to spot, but it sounds like dust is super common, so 1) is it okay to buy a lens with dust inside it? and 2) aside from a seller's feedback rating, how does one validate subjective claims like shutter "sounds good" and "image quality not affected?"

Lastly, any general tips for buying a lens site unseen (aside from feedback rating and return policy, that is)? Any specific questions you'd ask?

Oh, and why are so many coming from Japan?

[BrianShaw]

Tough questions. Don't know why there are lots of lenses in Japan but noticed the same thing. Nice lenses too.

There is no way to validate seller claims other than doing ones best to validate the sellers reputation. Sometimes 100% 5-star ratings is true but other times not so much. Good pictures with no "weasel words" is what I look for in all types of sales. I like reasonable return policies but go way out of my way to avoid returns - a hassle for both parties and too prone for complications.

Attitude is the major part of the answer. Expecting old stuff to be mint, like new, and in perfect operating condition is unrealistic. I plan on the potential for having a shutter or camera overhauled when looking at them.

The one thing I very carefully scrutinize is the possibility that it has been "user serviced". While that isn't always bad it often isn't a good situation.

[BrianShaw]

P.S. Dust in the lens and most "cleaning marks" don't affect image quality to any extent that I've ever noticed. Those two things don't scare me away nearly as much as some things do.

[Jac@stafford.net]

If the seller has any negative feedback whatsoever. AVOID. That's the stats. Zero tolerance. And zero negatives still does not guarantee quality.

[Alan Gales]

I recently purchased a Fuji lens from Japan and was very happy with it. A lot of others here and on APUG have been happy with purchases from Japan.

Almost all large format lenses will have at least a few specks of dust in them unless you are buying a brand new Cooke or something. Older lenses are bound to have more dust. A little dust won't hurt. A lot will. Most Sellers don't have shutter speed testers so they test the shutters by ear so they "sound good".

As a rule of thumb I assume any lens I buy from Ebay will need the shutter CLA'd unless it comes with a receipt from a recent CLA. If it doesn't then I am pleasantly surprised.

[Greg]

As far as I am concern...
dust no problem
bubbles in the glass, no problem
"cleaning marks" or separation, problem
"untested" problem
"fungus" problem
"shutter sounds OK" no problem, can always get it cleaned and calibrated
I would postulate that why so many lenses coming from Japan - cause of the exchange rate?

[Dan Fromm]

I'm with Alan and Greg. Can't stess too heavily that all used lenses' shutters need to be overhauled (the dread clean, lube, adjust) until proven otherwise.

OP, I don't know what you mean by "older." Nearly all LF lenses from, in alphabetical order, Fuji, Nikon, Schneider and Rodenstock offered on eBay are fairly recent. What we think of as modern lenses came in in the 1890s. Most of the major improvements in LF lenses since then have had to do with increased coverage given maximum aperture (big gains since the mid-50s) and flare resistance (huge gains immediately after WW-II, when coating became nearly universal, not so large since then). Modern (post mid-50s) wide angle lenses and modern telephotos (since ~ the mid-80s) beat older ones. Note, I'm talking about LF lenses, not lenses for smaller formats.

It is hard to make a horrible mistake buying a used lens represented as in good order through eBay, especially if payment is by PayPal or a major credit card. Never pay with a cash equivalent (check, money order, Western Union, ...).

I'm not sure how many used lenses are being offered on eBay by Japanese sellers. I've been fantasizing about getting a 125/5.6 Fuji for a while and have been watching them on eBay. About a dozen or so are on offer. And every several days to a week or so they're all relisted.

[BrianShaw]

I include the 1980s in my definition of 'older'. Seems just like yesterday but now it really was the 'good old days'.

[Tim Meisburger]

There are so many used LF lenses being sold from Japan now because for decades there were almost none being sold, due to language difficulties. Lately (the last few years) a few sellers have discovered ebay, and have the language skills to sell out of the country. The boom in LF lenses is matched by the boom in other photo gear, and reflects the fact that the Japanese have been camera mad for a long time, and so have a large stock of stuff siting around in the closet. Eventually all that loose stock will get sold off, and the market will even out.

For what its worth, I've always had good results buying out of Japan.

Tips: Stick to major brands and common sizes (90, 135, 150, 210). These will provide the best bang for the buck. If you can find them, sometimes you can get major brands re-branded as Caltar for a little cheaper. To avoid the vagaries of ebay, figure out what lens you want (say 150mm G-Claron), check completed listings on ebay to determine average price, then post a WTB add here on the forum. If you get an offer from someone well known on the forum, you can be relatively sure they know what to look for in a lens, and will stand behind their lens.

[Jim Jones]

Some of the lens designs still in production, such as the Tessar and the dialyte, have been around for a hundred years. Perhaps the most significant improvement in them has been in the coating that became the norm after WWII, and multi-coating many years later. If in good condition these lenses are capable of recording good images now as well as then. Such lenses in older shutters may not sync with strobes.

My few purchases from Japan have been totally satisfactory.

I second Tim's advice to buy from the For Sale/For Trade pages here as soon as you are eligible.