convert De Vere 504 Bench Enlarger (4x5) to 5x7 help needed

[interneg]

I use a 504 on a regular (not all day every day, but sometimes it feel like that) basis.

There are innumerable problems with attempting the Beseler approach with the DeVere & this is why I'd insist you contact Odyssey Sales before doing anything.

The 'hole' at the negative stage is a little bigger than 4x5 on a 504, how do you intend to prevent vignetting? the Beseler has a rather different & considerably bigger 'hole' at the neg stage I recall (I think my 45CB7 measures about 20x20cm, though this was not the model the 810 kit was designed for, better to find out what the 45mxt was)

If you've ever taken the dichroic/ condensor/ cold cathode head off a DeVere you'll see that the assemblies can be stripped down - the lens/ negative stage can be taken off the column - I'd have assumed to enable different neg stages for the 504/507/5108/515 to be assembled readily. That said, I have heard that the 5108 might use a different size of column - again Odyssey would know.

Once you're looking at light sources, I'd bet that the cost of a Heiland 10x8 LED head will be greater than what a good 5108 floorstander will cost... Or if you're intent on homebrewing it, make sure it weighs the right amount otherwise it'll go shooting up the column with enough force to severely injure someone the moment you unlock it...

[zsolt]

so here it is,forgive me,but i cant draw(as you see here)

[zsolt]

In Houston on a shoot will check when I get home

Thanks Luis!appreciate it!

[MartinP]

From memory you could re-use the base, column, focus-slider, head-slider. The supports for the head and the focus-stage (more space between axis and column), the head (with new light-source), the focus-stage (with new neg-holder), the bellows and the lens holder would all need to be fabricated.

[zsolt]

I use a 504 on a regular (not all day every day, but sometimes it feel like that) basis.

There are innumerable problems with attempting the Beseler approach with the DeVere & this is why I'd insist you contact Odyssey Sales before doing anything.

The 'hole' at the negative stage is a little bigger than 4x5 on a 504, how do you intend to prevent vignetting? the Beseler has a rather different & considerably bigger 'hole' at the neg stage I recall (I think my 45CB7 measures about 20x20cm, though this was not the model the 810 kit was designed for, better to find out what the 45mxt was)

read my post before-checkpicture after your post,i will replace it..

[/QUOTE]
If you've ever taken the dichroic/ condensor/ cold cathode head off a DeVere you'll see that the assemblies can be stripped down - the lens/ negative stage can be taken off the column - I'd have assumed to enable different neg stages for the 504/507/5108/515 to be assembled readily. That said, I have heard that the 5108 might use a different size of column - again Odyssey would know.
[/QUOTE]

no they dont,i dont know about 11x14 but till 8x10 its the same column..as i mentioned 2x before..

[/QUOTE]
Once you're looking at light sources, I'd bet that the cost of a Heiland 10x8 LED head will be greater than what a good 5108 floorstander will cost... Or if you're intent on homebrewing it, make sure it weighs the right amount otherwise it'll go shooting up the column with enough force to severely injure someone the moment you unlock it...[/QUOTE]

there are just other solutions that the 2-3000euro Heiland LED head..im sure it works supperwell,i dont question it,i have Heiland products,that im satisfied with.
lots of people made LED conversions..that work..and the blue (high contrast)is not a factor anymore,i know before it was..
royal blue...its blue..no-very little green in it.
and btw..as i mentioned before the light is already fixed.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this!
All the Best!
zs.

[zsolt]

From memory you could re-use the base, column, focus-slider, head-slider. The supports for the head and the focus-stage (more space between axis and column), the head (with new light-source), the focus-stage (with new neg-holder), the bellows and the lens holder would all need to be fabricated.

Thanks for your thoughts on this Martin!
light is fixed,bellows i can make -no problem-,neg holder ready,so i have to change the support for the head,and lens stage(what a friend will fix..)
so,all i have to do is when the friend made it change the stages with the 3 screws,(2x3 screws-2 stages-,sorry)attach the bellows,the light,insert the film holder,and im good..
check my drawing,its not super,but you might see what im planning to do better there,than i could explain..
AlltheBest Martin!
zs.

[jose angel]

Thanks for your info Jose!
the hole under the negative carrier is 14x15cm..(thats the reason i thought about a 13x18 conversion first)
yes,i plan to replace that part,and also make a small arm-elongation for the lens stage to compensate for the enlarging axis(thanks for pointing that out my friend!).and new bellows ..
btw,as mentione before,both is attached with 3 screws,so replacement is easy..and after if i want,can put everything back as it was..no harm.
made a stupid drawing of the plan,i will scan and post it..i hope it helps,and wont confuse you guys more..im not really good at drawing..

Looking at your sketch I`d still consider a 5x7" conversion instead. At a first sight it seems feasible without further modifications; looks like you only need to extend the frame a bit more than a couple centimeters on the long side (with say, a wooden DIY conversion box) and that`s all. You will get 5x7" capability and you could still adjust and use 4x5" with the right carriers without even using a screwdriver. You could buy good 5x7" carriers and masks (e.g., Durst) at a reasonable price, and "easily" build the conversion box to fit this carriers.
Another option could be machining the part and changing the bellows; you could get then a "true" 4x5"/5x7" enlarger.

If you are definitely decided on 8x10", you obviously need new parts. CNC is expensive, materials are expensive, bellows are expensive, carriers, etc. but I also think its easier to go ahead and made your own one than to find an affordable one in the used market.
I don`t see a problem on the light head... I`m using LED sources for a while now, never looked back. I also think steadiness is not of an issue... just attach an adjustable "V" arm from the top of the column to the wall and it will be rock solid.

[zsolt]

Looking at your sketch I`d still consider a 5x7" conversion instead. At a first sight it seems feasible without further modifications; looks like you only need to extend the frame a bit more than a couple centimeters on the long side (with say, a wooden DIY conversion box) and that`s all. You will get 5x7" capability and you could still adjust and use 4x5" with the right carriers without even using a screwdriver. You could buy good 5x7" carriers and masks (e.g., Durst) at a reasonable price, and "easily" build the conversion box to fit this carriers.
Another option could be machining the part and changing the bellows; you could get then a "true" 4x5"/5x7" enlarger.

If you are definitely decided on 8x10", you obviously need new parts. CNC is expensive, materials are expensive, bellows are expensive, carriers, etc. but I also think its easier to go ahead and made your own one than to find an affordable one in the used market.
I don`t see a problem on the light head... I`m using LED sources for a while now, never looked back. I also think steadiness is not of an issue... just attach an adjustable "V" arm from the top of the column to the wall and it will be rock solid.

i know Jose,that was the reason of my post(as started)to convert 5x7,and than i thought why not 8x10,if possible with a small change..
i didnt mention this,but the metal work will be for free cause the guy owes me,and will make it for free..and he is really good,already made some things for my cameras,an he knows what he is doing..everything works as should-as did before..bellows i can make,carriers i got.light is fixed,so as i see it,it might work out..
i could make 2-3x enlargements with the beauty with a 210-240,and to me that would be good enough for the time being
but i m curious to hear from Luis,or Ian if they could measure their 5108..
if its done-working i will post it here with pictures-dimensions,and this cnc computer drawing thing,dunno how they call it,the plan that the machine uses to make the thing.
so other people can make it themselfs..if anyone is interested in the conversion at all XD.
as i see it,its fairly easy,as an example,i would have more problems triing to make a De Vere column..

[zsolt]

I don`t see a problem on the light head... I`m using LED sources for a while now, never looked back.

Jose,than you MUST know this(if you dont you are welcome ) : http://www.jbhphoto.com/wp-content/u...Printing03.pdf
if you have the Heiland LED head,than forgive my DIY soul..

[Peter De Smidt]

I have a 504 floor-standing enlarger, and I've had an 810H. This seems doable. I agree about asking Odyssey Sales, possibly by a phone call. Over the years I've needed a few things. Occasionally, OS came through really affordably. Other times they were horrendously expensive. While it may be a long shot, they may have the needed parts sitting around that they'd love to get rid of. KHB in Canada is also a good, but usually very expensive, resource, as is Teamwork in London.