Buschman D movements vs. Super Graphic

[senderoaburrido]

I've been holding out for a late model, Toyo produced Super Graphic for a couple months now. I was interested in their relative abundance of movements, and occasionally low price (I had seen a few functional beaters on eBay for as low as 150 US). They appear to be nearly as functionally versatile as some of the more expensive cameras like the the Toyo and Wista brand technicals, and cheap enough that I wouldn't be uncomfortable bringing them with me on trips.

Now that I haven't seen any cheap auctions materialize for a month and a half, I'm looking at my other options. One of them is the Buschman D. There seem to be plenty on eBay, for decently low prices. I've seen plenty of posts in this forum and in others lauding its versatility and comparing it favourably to the Crown Graphic. Although it may be equal to the older Crown Graphic, I'm wondering how it compares to the Super Graphic and whether I should continue to hold out.

In particular I cannot seem to find the exact degrees of movement offered for tilt and swing. One of the primary reasons that I was interested in the Super Graphic is that it is capable of a surprising amount of tilt, shift, swing, rise and fall. Does the Buschman D offer similar specs?

[Dan Fromm]

Interesting. How does the Super Graphic as made by Toyo differ from the Super Graphic as made by Graflex? I ask because I don't know.

Be aware that the Super Graphic isn't the best camera for shortish lenses because its inner and outer bed rails aren't linked. Focusing a lens that makes infinity with the standard on the inner rails requires pushing and pulling.

Not to denigrate the Busch Pressman, but lens boards are hard to find and you may find the small lens throat limiting. Look before you leap.

[senderoaburrido]

Interesting. How does the Super Graphic as made by Toyo differ from the Super Graphic as made by Graflex? I ask because I don't know.

Be aware that the Super Graphic isn't the best camera for shortish lenses because its inner and outer bed rails aren't linked. Focusing a lens that makes infinity with the standard on the inner rails requires pushing and pulling.

Not to denigrate the Busch Pressman, but lens boards are hard to find and you may find the small lens throat limiting. Look before you leap.

Yeah, I had read about the throat. I currently have a Super Angulon f/5.6 90mm, and I know that won't fit. Looking to switch to a Nikkor f/8 for the added sharpness. Supposedly that just fits.

I'd also read about the rails in another thread. I realize it may be somewhat inconvenient, but it's not the worst feature. My concern with getting an older Crown Graphic is that it might not have the same movements, and more importantly, it may be significantly older and thus more likely to be worn and fail.

[Jac@stafford.net]

There is an article about the Busch Pressman by Dan Cozine on this site, here, in which he gives the front movement metrics.

A quote: "Movements are ample, but not anything close to a full-featured monorail. Bellows draw is about 12 inches. Focusing is performed by knobs on either side of the bed. Sandwiched next to the right focus knob is a 2nd knob that locks the focus. There is about 2 _ inches of front rise with locking nuts on both sides. The front standard tilts from the base about 30 degrees both forward and back. There is one locking nut to hold the tilt and a second that locks it straight. The geared shift is about _ inch, but no swing. The bed drops for use of wide-angle lenses or back tilt."

I have a Busch D home at this time and can measure the movements if you would like an affirmation, backup measure.

[Kevin Crisp]

You have to work at it to find a Crown Graphic that can't still do what it was designed to. They don't generally wear out. You can break the rangefinder by not learning how to adjust it. Usually the problems are due to poor storage, such as mildew or dirt. If you think a Super will be more reliable as it was a later generation, I think you just have to look at the particular sample you are considering of each.

[senderoaburrido]

There is an article about the Busch Pressman by Dan Cozine on this site, here, in which he gives the front movement metrics.

Hm. No swing at all is not ideal.

You have to work at it to find a Crown Graphic that can't still do what it was designed to. They don't generally wear out. You can break the rangefinder by not learning how to adjust it. Usually the problems are due to poor storage, such as mildew or dirt. If you think a Super will be more reliable as it was a later generation, I think you just have to look at the particular sample you are considering of each.

Does it possess identical degrees of tilt/shift/rise/swing/fall to the later model?

[Kevin Crisp]

The super is definitely the winner in available movements, though with some caveats as people have pointed out. Crown has front swing and front rise. It is possible to reconfigure it for front tilt too.

I personally think the crowns are great for what they can do and I do hand hold them. If more movements are essential, a reasonably light weight folder like a Tachihara or a Zone VI would be my preference. I did find the small opening and less board availability an issue with the Busch. As I recall I couldn't fit a 210mm Symmar on it.

[senderoaburrido]

The super is definitely the winner in available movements, though with some caveats as people have pointed out. Crown has front swing and front rise. It is possible to reconfigure it for front tilt too.

I personally think the crowns are great for what they can do and I do hand hold them. If more movements are essential, a reasonably light weight folder like a Tachihara or a Zone VI would be my preference. I did find the small opening and less board availability an issue with the Busch. As I recall I couldn't fit a 210mm Symmar on it.

The Tachihara's and Zone VI's that I see are quite expensive. Assuming I manage to earn better wages in the future, I would consider cameras in that price range. A beater of a TechniKardan or a Canham DLC would be fantastic. Gotta' admit that I don't trust wooden construction. As for right now, I'm making a little about 7-8$ US per hour and that is not really within reach.

Right now I'm just trying to find myself as cheap a portable camera as possible, with a minimum of 15 degrees tilt/swing and some decent rise/fall. Stubbornly I purchased a monorail for my first 4x5, and I'm finding it very difficult to use because I cannot transport it very easily. Although I'm looking to get my license this summer, I won't have regular access to a car for the foreseeable two or three years unless I stumble into a fortune. Ideally whatever equipment I have can fit into a hiking backpack so that I can bring it with me on my bike/the bus/hitchhiking.

[Kevin Crisp]

Sometimes Crowns are priced under market on Craigslist. People find them in a box in the garage and list them. I prefer the side rangefinder type.

On a very limited budget, an option is a Burke & James "Watson," which is kind of a press camera. As I recall it had basic movements. Tape up the rotating back as it will probably leak light. The best thing about this is that your pictures will look just as good as with a fancier more expensive camera. If in decent shape there is nothing wrong with wood cameras. My most used 5X7 is a pre-war Deardorff. So it's around 80 years old and going strong. Original bellows too.

[Dan Fromm]

The Tachihara's and Zone VI's that I see are quite expensive. Assuming I manage to earn better wages in the future, I would consider cameras in that price range. A beater of a TechniKardan or a Canham DLC would be fantastic. Gotta' admit that I don't trust wooden construction. As for right now, I'm making a little about 7-8$ US per hour and that is not really within reach.

Right now I'm just trying to find myself as cheap a portable camera as possible, with a minimum of 15 degrees tilt/swing and some decent rise/fall. Stubbornly I purchased a monorail for my first 4x5, and I'm finding it very difficult to use because I cannot transport it very easily. Although I'm looking to get my license this summer, I won't have regular access to a car for the foreseeable two or three years unless I stumble into a fortune. Ideally whatever equipment I have can fit into a hiking backpack so that I can bring it with me on my bike/the bus/hitchhiking.

Lessee, now. You're broke. And poor. You have a 4x5 monorail that you can't carry in a backpack. And you want to shoot 4x5.

To top it all you have requirements. To repeat them,

a minimum of 15 degrees tilt/swing and some decent rise/fall

I don't know where you got your requirements but many of us have got along with much, much less. Sell the monorail, get a Crown or Speed Graphic and find out whether 4x5 is for you.

But before you do that, consider whether a 4x5 view camera really is for you. What have you failed to do with a humble 35 mm camera that could be done with a view camera?