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Thread: Linhof Kardan question

  1. #11
    Tin Can's Avatar
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    Re: Linhof Kardan question

    Thanks Bob. I like my 50's Kardan. Very well made and work well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Salomon View Post
    The first Kardan had a unique knuckle like tilt/swing mechanism which made the camera yaw free as both tilt and swing were performed at the same point. However, this mechanism turned out to be too expensive to manufacture so, after this original Kardan was made as a prototype Linhof decided not to use it in their production version. But they did keep the name which they said meant a knuckle like device.
    There are far too many Kardan branded cameras to remember all, but from memory some were: Kardan, Kardan Color, Kardan Super Color (original round rail model), Kardan B, Kardan 45S, Kardan Super Color JBL, Kardan Standard, Kardan E, Kardan GT, Kardan Master L, Kardan GTL, Kardan TL, TechniKardan, TechniKardan S, Kardan M, and a few others.

  2. #12

    Re: Linhof Kardan question

    Quote Originally Posted by mihag View Post
    May I ask what's the benefit compared to the standard rigid rail?
    the telescopic rail is shorter and makes the camera easier to transport. I would love to get rid of my lightware case for the kardan, as it is huge.

  3. #13

    Re: Linhof Kardan question

    Quote Originally Posted by Randy Moe View Post
    Thanks Bob. I like my 50's Kardan. Very well made and work well.
    Kardan in German describes following: A drive shaft, driveshaft, driving shaft, propeller shaft (prop shaft), or Cardan shaft is a mechanical component for transmitting torque and rotation, usually used to connect other components of a drive train that cannot be connected directly because of distance or the need to allow for relative movement between them.

    When the Linhof Kardan was invented, the word Kardan was standing for innovation, BMW at about the same time got rid of the chain drive for their motorcycles and was pushing the envelope with a Kardan drive.

  4. #14

    Re: Linhof Kardan question

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Salomon View Post
    Yes
    Perfect, thank you

  5. #15

    Re: Linhof Kardan question

    Quote Originally Posted by HeinrichVoelkel View Post
    Kardan in German describes following: A drive shaft, driveshaft, driving shaft, propeller shaft (prop shaft), or Cardan shaft is a mechanical component for transmitting torque and rotation, usually used to connect other components of a drive train that cannot be connected directly because of distance or the need to allow for relative movement between them.

    When the Linhof Kardan was invented, the word Kardan was standing for innovation, BMW at about the same time got rid of the chain drive for their motorcycles and was pushing the envelope with a Kardan drive.
    Sorry for digging out this zombie.

    I think it's not about the drive shaft but a pivoted support system, c.f. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gimbal

    If I understand it correctly, "Kardan" means that there is a dual-axis gimbal to move the standard about two orthogonal pivot axes.

    There are a lot of Kardan-style Cameras around, even before Linhof came, e.g. "The Brand 17" in the U.S. - Are there any others?

    Later Linhof made the "Kardan Bi": it had two gimbal standards with additional base tilts.

    I write this because I am looking for some informations about the "Linhof Kardan Color" - a "Technika V" on an optical bench.

    Apparently even the Technika IV, V, ... are Kardan systems because their front standards works as - gimbals.

    Whereas the Technika III had only base tilt backwards.
    4x5, 120, 135

  6. #16

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    Re: Linhof Kardan question

    Bob Salomon will no doubt chime in, but still...

    The Linhof Color became the Linhof Kardan Color when rear rise and lever-activated front rise mechanism were introduced. The Kardan Color also had a cutout in the rear frame to allow for easier rise movement. Otherwise I think both are identical. I have both models.

    Kumar

  7. #17

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    Re: Linhof Kardan question

    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Casper Lohenstein View Post
    Sorry for digging out this zombie.

    I think it's not about the drive shaft but a pivoted support system, c.f. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gimbal

    If I understand it correctly, "Kardan" means that there is a dual-axis gimbal to move the standard about two orthogonal pivot axes.

    There are a lot of Kardan-style Cameras around, even before Linhof came, e.g. "The Brand 17" in the U.S. - Are there any others?

    Later Linhof made the "Kardan Bi": it had two gimbal standards with additional base tilts.

    I write this because I am looking for some informations about the "Linhof Kardan Color" - a "Technika V" on an optical bench.

    Apparently even the Technika IV, V, ... are Kardan systems because their front standards works as - gimbals.

    Whereas the Technika III had only base tilt backwards.
    The original prototype Kardan camera had a unique knuckle type joint that allowed it to do swings and tilts from the same joint. This was where the name Kardan came from. While in theory it worked and was yaw free and proved to be impractical to manufacture commercially. So when the Kardan went into production the cameras had separate tilt and swing points.

    There have been numerous Kardan models since then. The original round rail Super Color, the B the later SC JBL, the E, the M, the GT, GTL, L, Standard and several others.

  8. #18
    the Docter is in Arne Croell's Avatar
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    Re: Linhof Kardan question

    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Casper Lohenstein View Post
    Sorry for digging out this zombie.

    I think it's not about the drive shaft but a pivoted support system, c.f. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gimbal

    If I understand it correctly, "Kardan" means that there is a dual-axis gimbal to move the standard about two orthogonal pivot axes.

    There are a lot of Kardan-style Cameras around, even before Linhof came, e.g. "The Brand 17" in the U.S. - Are there any others?

    Later Linhof made the "Kardan Bi": it had two gimbal standards with additional base tilts.

    I write this because I am looking for some informations about the "Linhof Kardan Color" - a "Technika V" on an optical bench.

    Apparently even the Technika IV, V, ... are Kardan systems because their front standards works as - gimbals.

    Whereas the Technika III had only base tilt backwards.
    Daniel is right that a Kardan means gimbal - however, the connection to drive shafts (named “Kardanwelle” in German) comes from the fact that a drive shaft usually has one or more universal joints, which are based on gimbal mechanisms.

  9. #19

    Re: Linhof Kardan question

    Quote Originally Posted by Arne Croell View Post
    Daniel is right that a Kardan means gimbal - however, the connection to drive shafts (named “Kardanwelle” in German) comes from the fact that a drive shaft usually has one or more universal joints, which are based on gimbal mechanisms.
    Once I had a white BMW E21 whose engine hood opened itself at 150 km/h, three times ... It had a "Kardanwelle". I wonder how I could tinker the Linhof kardan Color into the BMW ... I am waiting, still, for the camera. Perhaps I find another E21 to mount he camera with its axis parallel to the drive shaft. Kardan to Kardan ;-)

    Of course you're right.

    Colour of the newly aquired cmaera is the same, ivory white, like the E21, what means that the camera is one of the younger specimen. Apparently it even has back rise.

    You all know how sceptical I am concerning Technikas - too much need for adjustment. The Kardan Color seems to be less complicated.

    The essential question is how it fits onto a ballhead. I have a Manfrotto MHXPRO, a Gitzo GH3870, a Gitzo GH2780 - the Gitzos with the Hejnar Arca Swiss clamp modification that I find quite good. But will it be strong enough to take the inhof Kardan Color? It's a very towered setup.

    Or should I get the dedicated "Linhof Kardan Panorama Neigekopf I Ø75mm pan tilt head 003613"?

    Regards
    4x5, 120, 135

  10. #20

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    Re: Linhof Kardan question

    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Casper Lohenstein View Post
    Once I had a white BMW E21 whose engine hood opened itself at 150 km/h, three times ... It had a "Kardanwelle". I wonder how I could tinker the Linhof kardan Color into the BMW ... I am waiting, still, for the camera. Perhaps I find another E21 to mount he camera with its axis parallel to the drive shaft. Kardan to Kardan ;-)

    Of course you're right.

    Colour of the newly aquired cmaera is the same, ivory white, like the E21, what means that the camera is one of the younger specimen. Apparently it even has back rise.

    You all know how sceptical I am concerning Technikas - too much need for adjustment. The Kardan Color seems to be less complicated.

    The essential question is how it fits onto a ballhead. I have a Manfrotto MHXPRO, a Gitzo GH3870, a Gitzo GH2780 - the Gitzos with the Hejnar Arca Swiss clamp modification that I find quite good. But will it be strong enough to take the inhof Kardan Color? It's a very towered setup.

    Or should I get the dedicated "Linhof Kardan Panorama Neigekopf I Ø75mm pan tilt head 003613"?

    Regards
    The Kardan Color front and rear standards have exactly the same movements as a Technika. So what are you referring to?
    Having to open a Technika to extend the front standard, or dropping the bed for wide angle or pressing a tab to get more extension?

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