If the negative is the score and the print the performance....

[John Kasaian]

If the negative is the score and the print the performance, I'd like the directions to the snack bar

[Eric Biggerstaff]

None of Ansel's assistants ever placed light to paper for any of his portfolio prints or prints sold to collectors, museums, etc. Alan, and other before him, printed the special edition prints only and of course Alan continues that to this day. I believe Rondal Partridge was the first of his assistants to do the special edition prints.

Many famous photographers did not print their own images, Cartier-Bresson believed his job ended once the neg was made. As has been mentioned Maplethorpe used an outside person to print as did Avedon and many others. Not sure if Irving Penn did but it would not surprise me.

That said, my feeling is that the print is what tells the story and it is up to me as the printer to make the choices needed to make that voice be heard. So, I cannot imagine letting someone else decide that for me.

[bob carnie]

I have printed for others from Day One leaving Fanshawe College in 1976.
I have found a few things out over this time as how to survive on printing alone ( $$$ do not come easy but I have to admit that now I am so happy I stuck it out ).

I hope the following does not come across self serving but here is a bunch of things I believe in and may be of interest to this discussion.

A decent Printer

- is to be like a Camelion- which means it is up to me to change my tone(pun) to match the photographer , and never force my print on them.
I always talk extensively with the photographer and do test printing sessions to establish a print style, ( I have found that there is over 50 styles that I work in and each photographer
may fit into one or two of these styles. It is our job to establish that style, this could include process, paper, toner, contrast , density , colour and so on.
- Always do two or three variations and give that to the photographer, as if you are printing for yourself- I am talking silver gelatin here.
- Be open to constructive critisism, and learn from that, you need a very thick skin .
- You will never make the perfect print , so do not obsess over this.
- The more times you have to print a certain negative the better the print could become, specifically with difficult lighting conditions.
- If you and the photographer do not agree then its time to split company.
- I have never printed photographers work that has been printed by others or even the photographer themselves ( some exceptions)
- Matching prints by others is just copy work and for me I would rather have my teeth pulled out than do this, without novacain btw.
-Some clients are price shopping from printer to printer and I usually do not work with these photographers as I see no loyalty with this.
- I love to work with clients on long term projects and get to know them and their work over years. ( I get most of the satisfaction from this)
- I would never let someone else make solarizations of my personal work, but would be very open to other printers using their talents on my non solarization work.. who would not want a Todd Gangler make a print for you.
- When in a printing session always group the negatives so they are similar and little changes from negative to negative, ( do not let the photographer dictate the order, its like a kid in the Candy Shop and you basically
go from their favourite to next and the session really slows down and you do not get any thing done.
- I make books Large Artist Sketch, that include a picture of all my work and that of others who I am printing large editions for. The notes I put on each page is , edition printed, was it a difficult print, how did I figure out
how to make the print. I do not record time apeture and such , but rather I write a plan on how I worked through the problem.
- Stand up for yourself when presenting prints, you may be in front of someone having a really bad day and you could become the target
-Never show prints in bad lighting, this is the kiss of death.
- Never argue, state your position and let it go from there, if after much testing the client still does not like your work , its time to move on.
- always try to support your work and go to the openings , no matter who it is. ( first shows are very difficult to attend but if you do not have the cohonies to be present then maybe printing for others is not for you.
-$$$ is always a hard topic, you must make sure you are paid for your work, never drop your price for volumne shows , in fact I charge more as its tougher to make a consistent body of work , which takes
more paper and time.
-$$ remember the kid in the Candy Store, if the Visa card does not match the desires then you can be on the losing end of this, unless you totally prepare your client for the costs involved over a long period of time.
-Presentation is king and $$$ are needed to fill this , so make sure Framing Quality is covered to show the work you are doing.

I have created monsters who want to be top notch , but after time life gets in the way , I have seen many potentially great photographers see life get in the way, and it saddens me sometimes but now as I get older
I try to keep them as friends and do not push them anymore to reach beyond their means, or vision.

Also for the younger printers here, Remember that over the last half century , hundreds of million slides, negatives have been exposed but never seen. so there is potential in reaching back and printing all this work.

[Jim Jones]

. . . So, in answer to the original question: I think I am the best printer of my negatives for two reasons. I know better than anyone else what I want from my photographs. Second, I print well enough to realize my vision; in other words, I can perform my scores satisfyingly, and sometimes virtuosically, enough to make another performer superfluous. . . .

True, but another printer with fine technique, more sophistication, and greater insight may well produce prints from my negatives that better show my intent than my own printing. As Doremus points out, this was very true in music. The master printer's personal interpretation of my negatives may also exceed my vision. This also is true in music. It is good to know as far as possible the original artist's intent, and also to appreciate how well it can be interpretated.

[Oren Grad]

...why then do people think they are the best printers of their own negatives?

Not everyone thinks that.

And independently of that, sometimes people are the best printers of their own negatives, and sometimes they're not.

Why isn't having expert printers making prints the standard?

Why does there need to be a "standard" for this? As long as the photographer is around, it's up to him as to whether his purposes are best served by making his own prints, collaborating closely with a printer, or just handing off to a printer.

[Peter Lewin]

This thread is an excellent catalyst for provoking thoughts about our own photography and printing. First, to state the obvious, photography and printing are separable skills. An individual may have a "good eye" for capturing images, or may be technically proficient at making prints; the two do not necessarily go together. As an example, I think I have decent image making skills, but am a very poor digital printer; therefore if my goal was a digital print, I would have to work with someone whose Photoshop skills exceed my own. On the other hand, I am a decent darkroom printer, and to use Doremus's words, "I print well enough to realize my vision." Therefore there is no definitive answer to the initial question of "who is the best printer" for their own images.

Second, the issue of "visualization" comes up in a number of posts. Again I have to use myself as an example. I make images that resonate for me, but I don't always have a "vision" of the final print when I trip the shutter. Perhaps Ansel always pre-visualized his photographs, I can merely say that (a) I'm no Ansel Adams, and (b) for me the process is not so easy to define, since "what resonates" is sometimes subconscious, or driven by subject as much as by a vision of the final product. Therefore when I print, I'm working for something that "looks good to me." There may be other interpretations that I would enjoy as much, if I had pushed the print in that direction, but once again, the process is not that mechanical, in some way the print takes me "where it wants to go." The point I am making (badly, I'm afraid) is that I might find a print made by someone else as, or more, satisfying, it may simply be that I didn't print the image in that way.

Lastly, for many (most?) of us, photography is a craft that we do for enjoyment; the majority of us are neither professional photographers nor professional printers. For that audience, making the final print is simply part of a process which we do "for fun." I like printing, and I get some ego satisfaction when others compliment me on a finished print. Whether it is the "best possible" print made from my negative is almost a non-issue; it is merely the best print that I can make, or more accurately, the best print I could make at that particular time.

[ROL]

Wow, Bob – Printer's Manifesto or just venting?

(FWInotW, I'd have to sign above the shooter if I printed for someone else! )

[bob carnie]

Maybe a bit of both,

Wow, Bob – Printer's Manifesto or just venting?

(FWInotW, I'd have to sign above the shooter if I printed for someone else! )

[Drew Wiley]

If the negative is the blunder, is the print the abomination? Ansel coined his phrase by being schooled in Classical music. He was lucky that hip-hop wasn't invented
yet.

[Lenny Eiger]

Much good has been said. I will add that a professional printer can point out things that an amateur may not see. Of course, so can a photo historian, and any other photographer that loves quality printing (not all do). The thing I see is that many people lack access to great printing. Some live in a rural area with no museums or galleries, others haven't had an interest. The name Ansel comes up all the time, regardless of the fact that he represents only one style of photographic printing. In the interest of developing one's own style one ought to look at a variety of styles, understand the salient parts of each, and decide for themselves.

It's very hard to produce something you don't understand. Until you train your eyes to see the subtleties, its hard to print them. They key is educating one's self, and continual study and growth. There are lots of people on this list who have gone thru the process and know exactly what they are after. For the less experienced, it can be helpful to get a print done by a professional, just to see what's possible.

Those that know exactly what they want also hire pros when they don't feel they have the time, or don't want to mess about with it, for whatever reason. It takes quite a bit to get a printer setup stable, whether it be in the darkroom, or tuning one's inkjet for b&w printing. There is a lot of learning to do.

As a professional printer, the hardest thing is to print in a different style for each person that prints with you. One has to listen to what they are saying, and listen to the style deep beneath the words.

Lenny