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Thread: Use of X-ray film: technical discussion with example images

  1. #561
    おせわに なります! Andrew O'Neill's Avatar
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    Re: X-ray Film example and comparison.

    Stripping the negative is fine for scanning and contact printing on silver papers. Did you have an alt process in mine?

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    Re: X-ray Film example and comparison.

    I want to try everything
    But pt/pd and carbon intrigues me. But I know nothing about them so I'm not worried about it right now.
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    All comments and thoughtful critique welcome

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    Re: X-ray Film example and comparison.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tim k View Post
    #1. I dont see how, this stuff is soft. If you figure out how let us know.
    Agreed. The emulsion is very soft when wet. I think a screen would leave marks. What might work, is the following:

    Make a tube out of bubble wrap that will fit inside your BTZS tube. If you can put the film inside the bubble wrap tube, and put the bubble wrap tube inside the BTZS tube, you might be able to avoid scratches, which mostly occur on removing the film from the tube. If the BW is too thick, there won't be room for the film, so you need small bubbles, but I think you do need bubbles, as they will keep the sleeve from collapsing during development, like a sock falling down, and they'll allow (theoretically) developer to get to both sides of the film. On the other hand, it might leave a bubble pattern on your film. No guarantees.

    I've had best luck with a pane of glass in the bottom of a tray. I suppose a glass/ceramic cake/casserole pan would work, too.

    If you're feeling very experimental, try the ziploc method. Put your film in a ziploc bag, pour in your developer, zip, and turn the bag over, end for end a few times every few minutes until your film is done. Pur out eh developer, rinse, fix, wash, all in the bag. This is tedious because the handling a bag full of liquid is awkward, and zipping/unzipping is kind of a pain, but it definitely works and won't scratch your film if you're careful removing it from the bag. Development has to be done in the dark, or under safe light. I've developed a lot of film this way, but it's always messy. What's needed is a lightproof, mylar zip-lock bag with a lightproof valve for pouring chems in and out. That would be a useful item.

  4. #564

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    Re: X-ray Film example and comparison.

    I've been playing around with Kodak Latitude x-ray film for a few weeks now and I'm finally getting some results that I like. I've been shooting it at asa 100 utilizing a spot meter an the zone system. Development has been in small trays Rodinal 1:200 for six minutes then stripping the back side with bleach. (Developing info received from this site)

    The high contrast has actually been a life saver a few times! The other day I was out shooting when it was really overcast and my subject was comparably flat. The Foma that I shot came out unprintable but the x-ray film had decent contrast and I got, almost, the exact image I was looking for! The only problems I'm having seem to be with the extreme ends of the range. I'm using a number 1 filter to print but I'm still having issues with shadows and highlights.

    Any suggestions? More diluted developer? Longer or shorter development times? I extended the development by 20% and really didn't see much difference in the negative which leads me to believe that I need to drop my development time. I'm still fairly new to the dark room and really new to x-ray in general so any advice is appreciated. I've never gone off the map like this and with no hard documentation for this film I'm not sure where to go with my experimentation next.

    Thanks!

    Jeremiah

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    Re: X-ray Film example and comparison.

    Jeremiah,

    I've not worried about controlling contrast because my printing process likes a lot of contrast, but if I was, I'd try my low contrast developer. I formulated it for use with Lith film, but it should work with X-ray film, too. The developer is still a work in progress, but the following should work for X-Ray film:

    TEA (triethanolamine) 75ml
    Ascorbic acid 1g
    Phenidone 7g
    TEA to 100ml

    Dilute 1:100

    Develop test negative by inspection to determine development time.

    If you're interested in trying this, PM me and I'll give you the basic instructions for mixing, etc. This stuff works really well with Lith film, and since it's so simple, it's easy to tune for any specific use, either by dilution, or by altering the ratio of phenidone to ascorbic acid. Keeping properties are generally very good, but depend somewhat on the way the concentrate is mixed and stored (it should be as dry as possible). The concentrate will last at least a year, under almost any conditions, and considerably longer if some basic precautions are taken. Good luck with your experimentation!

  6. #566

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    Re: X-ray Film example and comparison.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay DeFehr View Post
    Jeremiah,

    I've not worried about controlling contrast because my printing process likes a lot of contrast, but if I was, I'd try my low contrast developer. I formulated it for use with Lith film, but it should work with X-ray film, too. The developer is still a work in progress, but the following should work for X-Ray film:

    TEA (triethanolamine) 75ml
    Ascorbic acid 1g
    Phenidone 7g
    TEA to 100ml

    Dilute 1:100

    Develop test negative by inspection to determine development time.

    If you're interested in trying this, PM me and I'll give you the basic instructions for mixing, etc. This stuff works really well with Lith film, and since it's so simple, it's easy to tune for any specific use, either by dilution, or by altering the ratio of phenidone to ascorbic acid. Keeping properties are generally very good, but depend somewhat on the way the concentrate is mixed and stored (it should be as dry as possible). The concentrate will last at least a year, under almost any conditions, and considerably longer if some basic precautions are taken. Good luck with your experimentation!
    I'll admit a bit of trepidation when it comes to mixing my own developers. Not because I'm worried about messing it up but because I'm afraid of what it would lead to. You see, if I get involved in the chemistry of photography that deep, the next thing you know, I'll have maxed out my credit card at the chemical supply house, I'll have a spare bedroom full of chemicals and be taking courses at the university in chemistry. It will spiral out of control, my wife will leave me and take the cats.

    So you can see, the only good that can come out of this is me getting rid of the cats!

  7. #567

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    Re: X-ray Film example and comparison.

    Quote Originally Posted by UberSquid View Post
    I'll admit a bit of trepidation when it comes to mixing my own developers. Not because I'm worried about messing it up but because I'm afraid of what it would lead to. You see, if I get involved in the chemistry of photography that deep, the next thing you know, I'll have maxed out my credit card at the chemical supply house, I'll have a spare bedroom full of chemicals and be taking courses at the university in chemistry. It will spiral out of control, my wife will leave me and take the cats.

    So you can see, the only good that can come out of this is me getting rid of the cats!
    Understood! We should always err on the side of caution where impulsive/obsessive behavior is a risk. And you're probably in deep enough with LF X-Ray film!

  8. #568

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    Re: X-ray Film example and comparison.

    Out of curiosity though, where does one find such chemicals? I'm sure that they could be ordered online but I'm wondering about local supply. If I could find a local supply of raw chemicals then it would make sense to start mixing instead of ordering my packaged chemicals from the internet.

    I've found the local co-op to be a great source for other projects but they assure me that they don't have Phenidone.

  9. #569

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    Re: X-ray Film example and comparison.

    Hello slippery slope! I don't know where local is for you, but if you were in Seattle you could pick up some phenidone at Glazer's, and ascorbic acid at Madison Market, among many other places, I imagine. The TEA is the difficult one. I get mine from The Chemistry Store, by the gallon. You can get ascorbic acid there, too. I get most of my other chemicals from Artcraft Chemicals. Even with shipping, compounding your own chemicals can be far less expensive than buying commercial products, and you gain access to a world of formulas not commercially available, like the one posted above. Ok, enough preaching. Let me know if I can enable you...er.....help.

  10. #570

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    Re: X-ray Film example and comparison.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay DeFehr View Post
    Hello slippery slope! I don't know where local is for you, but if you were in Seattle you could pick up some phenidone at Glazer's, and ascorbic acid at Madison Market, among many other places, I imagine. The TEA is the difficult one. I get mine from The Chemistry Store, by the gallon. You can get ascorbic acid there, too. I get most of my other chemicals from Artcraft Chemicals. Even with shipping, compounding your own chemicals can be far less expensive than buying commercial products, and you gain access to a world of formulas not commercially available, like the one posted above. Ok, enough preaching. Let me know if I can enable you...er.....help.
    I live in Bloomington Indiana. It's a college town but for all intents and purposes it's a small rural town that likes to think it's not so no chemical supply depot here. Indianapolis is an hour away so I can drive up there to procure materials I just need a direction to go in. Since chemical photography isn't really mainstream anymore it's not like there are photo warehouses in major cities like there used to be. With other projects I've found the similar industries that use the components that I need such as getting Argon from a welding supply shop. I didn't know if there was anything similar in photo chemical supply.

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