Photography and Politics

[jnantz]

brian you forgot

" if rioters send offensive emails and pm's to moderator staff about their decisions,
the offending parties get 30 day time out, and if it happens 2nd time a 60 day time out, and a 3rd time, banishment to the the LFPInfo factory to make dark slides."

[cowanw]

sure, but my point is, they are not static, disjunct or abstract: they are an integral part of the community. Moderators are sometimes talked about as if they were some higher power or somehow set apart from the community. I think that's a misconception.

This addresses my post about root causes. If one of the root causes of the current problem is an issue with moderation in response to a few problematic posts, then perhaps a modification of the moderation response is in order. That may go a long way to returning things to normal

[baro-nite]

Is it possible to write without political position or point of view? Are we reaching for an impossible ideal?

Yes, and yes. I can't conceive of a set of guidelines that will do substantially better than the current ones, at keeping moderator workload reasonable while keeping discussion civil and on-topic. If a work has an obvious component of advocacy, it should be possible to discuss how well the work serves that purpose, photographically, without debating the merits of the position the work presumably advocates. That discussion must be civil and on-topic is sufficient, and about all we can do. That such discussion will stray out of bounds is inevitable, hence the moderators will always have their work cut out.

Obviously I haven't thought about this nearly as deeply as the moderators, but here's a thought: don't delete posts. If a thread needs to be closed (after appropriate warnings), then close it, but leave the offending posts up for all to see. This would be easier for the mods and would allow all of us to form our own opinions.

[goamules]

Wait - is anyone going to comment on my simple plan? Or is the point of all this to just argue? Each side has a....er....side. Neither will convince the other. Why argue about personal belief systems?

My plan is simple, and equalizes moderation to everyone. Don't like democracy or 3 people that can delete? Change it to 8. The forum software won't handle it? Start every thread in the new Politics and Photography section with a Poll. Two choices: A) keep this thread, B) delete this thread. After 1 week, the moderators check the poll and take action. No reading required.

What's so hard about that?

[goamules]

If you don't like being moderated by a single person, then let it by by group consensus. What is fairer than that? Unless....of course...people with political agendas want their thoughts to remain up....no matter what. That couldn't be.

[rdenney]

One of the things we have heard is the need to allow marginal voices. I'm opposed to any group moderation that would enforce the dominant paradigm, or make it possible for three active people to control what remains. If three moderators attract this sort of abuse, what about three secret naysayers?

Rick "an open politics subforum has already been tried" Denney

[jnantz]

i originally had a long blathering suggestion
but realized that it would probably take too much
effort and stress on the part of the people behind the red
curtain ...

and garrett's suggestion
seems more reasonable
then $$ spent and more
tme spent monitoring ...

[bob carnie]

Plus 1

Kind of like what I was trying to say about voting off the island, this makes sense to me.


After 10 plus years here I think I can figure out when someones being an ass and derailing a thread.

Wait - is anyone going to comment on my simple plan? Or is the point of all this to just argue? Each side has a....er....side. Neither will convince the other. Why argue about personal belief systems?

My plan is simple, and equalizes moderation to everyone. Don't like democracy or 3 people that can delete? Change it to 8. The forum software won't handle it? Start every thread in the new Politics and Photography section with a Poll. Two choices: A) keep this thread, B) delete this thread. After 1 week, the moderators check the poll and take action. No reading required.

What's so hard about that?

[Tin Can]

I think we have a bit of this.

Your Poll on every new Photo/Politic thread is a very good idea, it also show how folks vote.

Kinda like a show of hands.

Good one!

If you don't like being moderated by a single person, then let it by by group consensus. What is fairer than that? Unless....of course...people with political agendas want their thoughts to remain up....no matter what. That couldn't be.

[goamules]

Thanks. I thought it would be a good idea. Moderation by all. It would fix a lot of problems with what people see is too much control by some. Of course, a control freak would not want it, saying something like "we can't trust the people to do that..." Oh....it's already been said.

But even if the Poll system isn't implemented, at least having a sand box for politics could be fine. Just keep them out of every thread. That does what Bob says, creates drama anywhere a person with an agenda wants. The thread that started all this was a photographer trying to give support to a certain group. I could start a thread showing another group. Those threads should not be "voted off the island." But something that seems intentionally adversarial should be.