Mystery Dagor...

[Dan Fromm]

Looks like a very nice lens! A dagor type that dates to around 1920...

If you don't have the serial number, how can you date it?

[Embdude]

P-H Pont's chronology says that Koilos shutters with air brakes were made from 1906 - 1910. I asked why you think it is a Dagor because many European makers made 6 elements in two groups double anastigmats in that period. Some had f/6.8 maximum apertures, others were faster, still others slower.

It was my understanding that Goerz first produced and patented the DAGOR type and also licensed it out... I am basically just using DAGOR as a general descriptor...

[Embdude]

If you don't have the serial number, how can you date it?

Oh I was referring to Randy's 300mm Schneider that he mentioned... I'll go edit it to make it more clear... Can't really date mine unless someone recognizes it...

[Embdude]

Some of the Ensign Anastigmats look similar and they used a Kilios shutter too but I did not see a 12in 6.8 one...

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthoped...-5in-306463216

[Embdude]

Lens housing adapter to accept an 11 1/2" (292mm) F4 Wollensak Verito looks similar to this one glenview has...
http://www.glennview.com/shutters.htm

[Dan Fromm]

It was my understanding that Goerz first produced and patented the DAGOR type and also licensed it out... I am basically just using DAGOR as a general descriptor...

Correct. But other makers designed and made 6/2 double anastigmats without, it seems, licenses from Goerz or suits for patent infringement. For example, Berthiot introduced anastigmatic Eurygraphes in 1896-7, some with maximum apertures of f/6.8.

I'm sure you mean well, but I've seen enough inaccurate, possibly dishonest, eBay listings to want people not to use Dagor as a general descriptor. "Dagor type," ok, no possible attempt to cheat there. "Dagor" when not clearly made by Goerz or a licensee and not clearly a Ser. III double anastigmat, cheating galore.

I was once taken by a person who sold me an f/6.8 Goerz Double Anastigmat as a Dagor. I asked the person to count reflections, it assured me that the lens was a Dagor. I received one of Goerz' low end dialyte types. I hope you understand why I'm sensitive about "Dagor, I think,. I wish, I hope, well, perhaps."

[Embdude]

Correct. But other makers designed and made 6/2 double anastigmats without, it seems, licenses from Goerz or suits for patent infringement. For example, Berthiot introduced anastigmatic Eurygraphes in 1896-7, some with maximum apertures of f/6.8.

I'm sure you mean well, but I've seen enough inaccurate, possibly dishonest, eBay listings to want people not to use Dagor as a general descriptor. "Dagor type," ok, no possible attempt to cheat there. "Dagor" when not clearly made by Goerz or a licensee and not clearly a Ser. III double anastigmat, cheating galore.

I was once taken by a person who sold me an f/6.8 Goerz Double Anastigmat as a Dagor. I asked the person to count reflections, it assured me that the lens was a Dagor. I received one of Goerz' low end dialyte types. I hope you understand why I'm sensitive about "Dagor, I think,. I wish, I hope, well, perhaps."

I totally agree, if listed for sale it needs a proper description... I have never sold a LF lens and don't intend to start. I am merely entertained by the mystery of the lens and the challenge of figuring it all out, including shooting with it eventually... If it turns out to be a good lens I plan to put it on my 13x18 Bermpohl Naturfarbenkamera...

[linhofbiker]

I am clearing out my collection of LF lenses from the last 20+ years. If they won't cover 5x7 and 4x10 then they must go. Two of my lenses are Symmar Doppel Anastigmats f/6.8 in shutters 240mm and 270mm. Both are 80 degree lenses and should cover OK. Since they may be almost 80-90 years old I will use them only for B/W which goes without saying since color in 5x7 is hard to find, although I do have some 8x10 Provia to be cut down to 4x10. Anyone know of the color capability of these old lenses?

[Dan Fromm]

Y'know, Schneider's serial number sequence is known. What are your old Symmars serial numbers?

Dagors of all ages are good for color. Why should dagor-type Symmars be different?

[linhofbiker]

Y'know, Schneider's serial number sequence is known. What are your old Symmars serial numbers?

Dagors of all ages are good for color. Why should dagor-type Symmars be different?

Dan:

The 24cm is in a #4 Acme Synchro, there is no number on the front element, but on the rear is 1787168 (about 1942).
The 27cm is in a dial set Compur with the number 243371 on both elements (about end of 1928).

The dates are from Schneiders website.

I don't understand why the 24cm has no number.