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Thread: ROTARY DEVELOPMENT: Uneven development : Xtol 1:1 / Jobo 3010 ???

  1. #1

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    ROTARY DEVELOPMENT: Uneven development : Xtol 1:1 / Jobo 3010 ???

    I have been facing this problem for quite some time. I can't seem to figure out why this is happening. Any suggestions? It seems random and the pattern is always the same. Below are two scans of two separate negatives developed on two separate runs showing the problem. I have increased the contrast in PS to make the problem more evident.




    Things I have tried to eliminate this

    -Levelled the drum on the rotary base making sure there is no wobble as it spins
    -Used fresh stocks of Xtol
    -Pured dev on opposite compartments of the jobo 3010 in reference to film
    -increased frequency of changes in drum development spin direction

    My dev is
    (done on cibachrome motor base)

    5-10 min prewash (multiple water changes [~2-3])/ flip direction per wash
    4 min dev /flip direction every 30s
    1 min wash with water /flip direction every 30s
    6 min Tetanol super fix plus /flip direction every 3min
    1 min wash with water /flip direction every 30s
    3x 5 min wash with water /flip direction per water changes
    take negs out of drum and immerse in water+tetanol mirasol
    dry on clothesline initially "mopping" away the excess buildup of water at bottom edge

  2. #2

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    Re: ROTARY DEVELOPMENT: Uneven development : Xtol 1:1 / Jobo 3010 ???

    The first thing I'd do is get rid of the pre-wash.

  3. #3
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    Re: ROTARY DEVELOPMENT: Uneven development : Xtol 1:1 / Jobo 3010 ???

    How much developer solution are you using? How much wash water to chase the developer?

    How do you fill and empty the drum?

    Have you tried leaving out the prewash?

    4 minutes is a *very* short, very unforgiving development time, especially if you need to stop the drum's rotation to fill and empty it.

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    Re: ROTARY DEVELOPMENT: Uneven development : Xtol 1:1 / Jobo 3010 ???

    pre wash is fine but no need for 10 min!
    Where'd you get this idea?
    2 minutes has always worked for me.
    how much developer are you using?
    only 4 minutes in developer? that's unusual too and kodak manuals will tell you that as well. dilute your developer and double that time.
    no need to flip direction with the expert tanks. I do it with my jobo for the first minute of each step but it's not going to help with development.
    don't push the film all the way down in the tubes.

    check the film after your stop bath (open the drum, pull a sheet and look at it)

  5. #5
    おせわに なります! Andrew O'Neill's Avatar
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    Re: ROTARY DEVELOPMENT: Uneven development : Xtol 1:1 / Jobo 3010 ???

    As Bruce said, get rid of the prewash. It's really not necessary.

  6. #6
    http://www.spiritsofsilver.com tgtaylor's Avatar
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    Re: ROTARY DEVELOPMENT: Uneven development : Xtol 1:1 / Jobo 3010 ???

    I'd:

    1. Skip the pre-rinse.

    2. You didn't mention the film brand but it would appear that you are processing at a high temperature - 75 to 80F. I would lower the processing time to 68F which would give you a longer development time.

    3. Consider a 1:1 dilution with Xtol - especially with night shots.

    4. Download the Xtol datasheet from the Kodak website.

    Thomas

  7. #7

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    Re: ROTARY DEVELOPMENT: Uneven development : Xtol 1:1 / Jobo 3010 ???

    The film used is Acros 100. The developer is Xtol 1:1; 100mL is used per film sheet. The dev time is so short because I am trying to capture the high contrast. Longer dev times blow the highlights in bright street lamps. I have been mentally discouraged in trying a more dilute developer dilution as I thought this might significantly increase grain (which I am trying to minimise). On a more minor note, the increase the volume of the developer per sheet of film (e.g. 1:2 =50mL Xtol +100mL h2o = 150mL) would prevent me from using 10 sheets per run. But perhaps this could be a good idea... 1:2 for 6m? 1:3 for 8m?

    Of note, its is quite strange that not all film sheets turn out like this in any given single run (OR perhaps I the uneven dev is not object able in uneven/textured areas??). That is in a run some sheets might have such anomalies while others do not. This made me think that the pouring of the dev into the tank (tank being off the machine base) might have been the cause. However, I have tried loading film in one chamber and then pouring dev in an opposing chamber of the 3010 therefore the dev should not touch the film sheet until the rotation starts. I still ocassionally get this problem. Perhaps the way the film sits in the chamber is important?

    Its interesting that so many people recommend eliminating the prewash? I have tried this before and found that the prewash assists in getting a more even development. So this step seems counter intuitive.

    What might be a clue is that the film perforation (top right in negs) seems to have inconsistencies in the dev of film area surrounding it. Possibly from the disturbance of the dev currents?

    What impact would a longer prewash have on the dev inconsistency? My impression is that a longer prewash ensures all the film is evenly soaked?

    I like the idea flowering temperature but I do not have the option to do this.I try and keep my water/dev at 20*C.

    The next thing I though of trying is pouring in the dev while the drum is spinning?? It might be a bit challenging..

  8. #8
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    Re: ROTARY DEVELOPMENT: Uneven development : Xtol 1:1 / Jobo 3010 ???

    Quote Originally Posted by l2oBiN View Post
    The film used is Acros 100. The developer is Xtol 1:1; 100mL is used per film sheet. The dev time is so short because I am trying to capture the high contrast. Longer dev times blow the highlights in bright street lamps. I have been mentally discouraged in trying a more dilute developer dilution as I thought this might significantly increase grain (which I am trying to minimise). On a more minor note, the increase the volume of the developer per sheet of film (e.g. 1:2 =50mL Xtol +100mL h2o = 150mL) would prevent me from using 10 sheets per run. But perhaps this could be a good idea... 1:2 for 6m? 1:3 for 8m?

    Of note, its is quite strange that not all film sheets turn out like this in any given single run (OR perhaps I the uneven dev is not object able in uneven/textured areas??). That is in a run some sheets might have such anomalies while others do not. This made me think that the pouring of the dev into the tank (tank being off the machine base) might have been the cause. However, I have tried loading film in one chamber and then pouring dev in an opposing chamber of the 3010 therefore the dev should not touch the film sheet until the rotation starts. I still ocassionally get this problem. Perhaps the way the film sits in the chamber is important?

    Its interesting that so many people recommend eliminating the prewash? I have tried this before and found that the prewash assists in getting a more even development. So this step seems counter intuitive.

    What might be a clue is that the film perforation (top right in negs) seems to have inconsistencies in the dev of film area surrounding it. Possibly from the disturbance of the dev currents?

    What impact would a longer prewash have on the dev inconsistency? My impression is that a longer prewash ensures all the film is evenly soaked?

    I like the idea flowering temperature but I do not have the option to do this.I try and keep my water/dev at 20*C.

    The next thing I though of trying is pouring in the dev while the drum is spinning?? It might be a bit challenging..
    Having fought with patterns like this in C41 I would suggest trying to use a longer time somehow - the pouring time will probably be long in comparison with the overall time of dev. In fact turning it around won't be helping much either.

    I also had a slightly 'warped' 3010 in which the film was touching the back of the drum slightly which didn't help much. Check you have an even space behind the film once loaded. I would mark the film positions so you can check which ones may be causing a consistent problem.

    Pre-wash shouldn't cause any problems and in my case it solved some problems. Longer prewash won't do anything once the emulsion is soaked.

    Tim
    Still Developing at http://www.timparkin.co.uk and scanning at http://cheapdrumscanning.com

  9. #9
    Format Omnivore Brian C. Miller's Avatar
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    Re: ROTARY DEVELOPMENT: Uneven development : Xtol 1:1 / Jobo 3010 ???

    Quote Originally Posted by l2oBiN View Post
    My dev is
    (done on cibachrome motor base)
    OK, there's your problem. The streaks are from the developer not initially being distributed correctly as it flows on the film. When a tank is attached to a Jobo unit, the developer is poured in as the drum rotates. In your case, you are pouring the developer in without the drum in motion.

    For doing something like this, leave one tube empty when you are loading your film. Put the developer into the empty tube, before you put on the lid. Then, with the motor base running, flip the drum onto the base.

    While a prewash isn't necessary, it does retard the first contact of the developer with the film. You'd have to leave a slot empty, do the prewash, and then pop the lid and put the developer in the empty tube.
    "It's the way to educate your eyes. Stare. Pry, listen, eavesdrop. Die knowing something. You are not here long." - Walker Evans

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    Peter De Smidt's Avatar
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    Re: ROTARY DEVELOPMENT: Uneven development : Xtol 1:1 / Jobo 3010 ???

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian C. Miller View Post
    OK, there's your problem. The streaks are from the developer not initially being distributed correctly as it flows on the film. When a tank is attached to a Jobo unit, the developer is poured in as the drum rotates. In your case, you are pouring the developer in without the drum in motion.
    Brian is right. I use expert drums on a CPP-2 with Acros and Xtol with no pre-rinse on a regular basis. It works just fine. I've heard of people rigging up systems to enable adding solution while the drum is spinning on a base. A search on APUG should prove useful.
    “You often feel tired, not because you've done too much, but because you've done too little of what sparks a light in you.”
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