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Thread: Baryta vs non-baryta inkjet papers: archival stability??

  1. #1

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    Baryta vs non-baryta inkjet papers: archival stability??

    Hi guys, I just finished testing several of the latest greatest inkjet papers, and my two personal faves were Ilford Gold Fibre Silk (a baryta paper) in first place, and the new Canson Platine Fibre Rag, which is not a baryta product, in second place.

    The white point of the Canson paper is lower by a smidge, but otherwise the papers, surfaces, etc., are close enough that the difference is negligible to my eye.

    So then, the question of archival stability. The Canson is an acid-free rag paper (the only one of the bunch), has no optical brighteners, and claims to be made "without chemical substances that contribute to premature deterioration."

    Does anyone have any educated guesses as to how this compares archivally with the baryta papers, the Ilford in particular?

  2. #2

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    Re: Baryta vs non-baryta inkjet papers: archival stability??

    I don't think the paper is the issue. I think the dried ink will start to flake off long before the paper deteriorates significantly. All that constant warming and cooling and humidity changes will affect the surface layer over time and that surface layer is a dried pigment layer which is designed along with the paper not to soak into the paper so that you don't get bleed when it prints. Bit of a dilemma that one...
    I could be wrong though but then why do people put acrylic varnish over inkjets on canvas?

  3. #3

    Re: Baryta vs non-baryta inkjet papers: archival stability??

    until there are actual tests, probably by Aardenberg, there's no real way of knowing outside of marketing hype. As a side note though, the Canson you liked.. looks like they have some new baryta papers as well... just to complicate matters.
    I honestly didn't think to recommend the Ilford, since the prints I've seen that have done in the past were on cold base papers. I like the look of it, and it's performance, but had a lot of handling problems with rolls. Sheets, no problem.
    Tyler

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    Re: Baryta vs non-baryta inkjet papers: archival stability??

    I don't know that there's anything useful that can be said on this, other than to follow Wilhelm and Aardenburg and see whether they test the papers you're interested in.

    If you join Aardenburg's membership program - not expensive - you can have a voice in their choice of materials to test.

    http://www.aardenburg-imaging.com/cg...17c3Vic2NyMQ==

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    Re: Baryta vs non-baryta inkjet papers: archival stability??

    Funny how we did not care about this for silver photos, beyond the drills for washing and toning, but that was about the image, not the paper. The baryta papers, at least Harmon, appear to be about the same as traditional silver papers minus the silver. I am also of the opinion that the inks are really the issue, esp. with color. If the print gets enough light or other harsh environmental conditions the ink is going to shift before the paper goes. I think we are at the point where the issue is perception, and the art market seems to have made the shift. They really made the shift 40 years ago when collectors and museums starting buying color prints, they just did not realize it.:-) Except for some color transfers, which are about as good a current inkjet prints, none of the color stuff was remotely stable compared with current inkjet technology. But then Pollack's and Rauschenberg's paintings are also falling apart.

    Ars longa, vita brevis - but only for ceramics and marble?

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    Re: Baryta vs non-baryta inkjet papers: archival stability??

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Richards View Post
    Ars longa, vita brevis - but only for ceramics and marble?
    But digital is forever. Maybe.

    --Darin

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    Re: Baryta vs non-baryta inkjet papers: archival stability??

    Chris, What did you like about the Gold Fibre Silk, and how did it compare to the Harman Baryta Fiber Gloss paper? (Did you try the latter?)

    There's also that Wilhelm Digital Research guy, who does a lot of the accelerated testing.

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    Re: Baryta vs non-baryta inkjet papers: archival stability??

    My 2cs Neil. In terms of b&w. I really liked the GFS at first but once I hung a show with it, I came to hate the cool base color as Tyler noted. It looks drab. Of the two I now much prefer the recent Harman BFG, which has a whiter more neutral base color. I don't print color. Is the base color more noticeable to b&w printers? I almost never hear color printers discussing base color.
    Thanks,
    Kirk

    at age 73:
    "The woods are lovely, dark and deep,
    But I have promises to keep,
    And miles to go before I sleep,
    And miles to go before I sleep"

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    Re: Baryta vs non-baryta inkjet papers: archival stability??

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Richards View Post
    Funny how we did not care about this for silver photos, beyond the drills for washing and toning, but that was about the image, not the paper...

    Ars longa, vita brevis - but only for ceramics and marble?
    The widely-held belief that if only you fix your silver prints carefully, tone them in Kodak Rapid Selenium Toner 1+20 for a couple of minutes and then wash them thoroughly, you're guaranteed an artifact for the ages, is quite mistaken. There's a lot more to it than that, and still all sorts of things we don't know about the silver gelatin papers we're printing on and their possible failure modes under different environmental conditions. But paper is always fragile over the very long term.

    Anyway, color shifts in the ink, and base discoloration and shifts in perceived ink color attributable to decay of OBAs in those papers that have them, are the likely early failure modes for pigment inkjet prints on a decent base. Mark McCormick-Goodhart, who's running the Aardenburg operation, evidently thinks that Wilhelm's tests substantially underestimate the degree of fading likely to be experienced under real-world conditions. He has his own alternative test approach.

    Anyone who is seriously worried about this needs to follow both the Wilhelm and Aardenburg tests closely, read up about ways prints can deteriorate and how that relates in general to storage and display conditions, and make their own judgments. Nobody has any definitive answers.

    So yeah, only for ceramics and marble (but watch that acid rain)...

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    Re: Baryta vs non-baryta inkjet papers: archival stability??

    The Canson is an acid-free rag paper (the only one of the bunch)
    Not sure what you mean by this. There are lots of acid- and lignen-free inkjet papers, many of them are cotton rag and some are alpha-cellulose, and all should hold up quite well. Variability in longevity with these papers is more likely to come down to the ink-receptive coatings on the papers, as well as the inks themselves.

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