GOERZ CELOR F5 Series 1b No 3 8 1/4 in

[Simon Benton]

A while back I purchased an old 8X10 Seneca for spare parts and included with it was a Goerz Celor f5 Series 1b NO 3 8 1/4 inch lens in an Alphax 4 shutter. The glass is in good shape and the shutter performs well and speeds are close. I can find very little information about this lens and wonder if any members can enlighten me. It certainly seems to cover 8X10. Any information about this lens would be very welcome especially coverage, quality and value.

[Steve Hamley]

From the LCVM:

Series 1b Celor This was a lens where the maximum aperture varied with the focus of the lens in the same series. Thus it can be found in f3.5 (for movie perhaps?) down to f5.5 in the longer sizes. f4.5 60mm (Goe021) for 60-70° angle. This aperture seems to have been offered later as 6-48cm, so that the f4.5 was the well known speed and was referred to in Frerk's book, but was then out of production in 1926, though possibly sold under camera makers labels. Coma could limit sharpness here.

f4.0 This aperture was noted on an Anschutz Plate, B.J.A. 1905.
f3.5 There are no details here but it may have been for movie use.
f4.8 90-180mm, use 5 or 6in for 5x4. These seem to be one of the more common
types, from old 1/2 plate cameras, in SFIM. It is rather too easy to buy these in mistake for Dagor as the engraving is small and very hard to read on old and dusty lenses. They were Series 1B Celor at No261,46x.

One was noted on a 10x14cm Anschutz camera as a f4.8/168mm at No253,94x
Fig 026 007 Goerz Celors f4.8 (l) 180mm No333,440 in brass barrel; (mid) 180mm No 261,469 in SIM;(r)
150mm No199,110 in SFIM.
f5.0 210-270mm
f5.5 300-480mm

Here the lens is really the same, the different foci being made at different maximum apertures. These seem to be the lenses suggested for Portraiture in f4.5- f5.5 in 1908. The slower f6.3 Celor and Syntor were the suggestion for Groups and general work outdoors. Apertures varied, in 1911 they were f4.5,2.375; f4.8,3.5-7in; f5.0,8.5-10.75; f5.5,12-19in.

Also,

http://www.cameraeccentric.com/html/info/goerz_2.html

George Hurrell used a 16-1/2" f:5 Celor for most of his later non-soft Hollywood portraits, which are the ones he is famous for. Examples 12" or shorter don't seem to bring nearly what the rarer, longer ones do.

Here's the only one I've seen recently:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Hurrells-Secret-12-In-Goerz-Celor-series-1B-f5-5-lens_W0QQitemZ290270961358QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item290270961358&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A13|39%3A1|240%3A1318

I doubt the corners would be very sharp at infinity.

Cheers,

Steve