DavidOriginally Posted by David Luttmann
What's with the "we this" and "we that" or has the Queen recently bestowed upon you some royal entitlement to the royal plural "we" are unaware of? You seem to have been harassing Jorge at every opportunity too - just about every time he makes a post, you respond (although you go to great pains to tell us he's on "ignore"... yeah sure)...
If you want to be treated like an adult, behave like one. Begging for the moderators to ban him???... School's out.
"We" refers to the numerous people Jorge personally attacks. As it is more than one, and I form part of that group, it cannot be referred to in the singular.
Not sure why that was difficult to understand....but now you know.
I just hadn't realized that you had been elected the class rep. at the kindergarden.
Since Don quoted one of the clowns and I was forced to read the post, a few things strike me a funny. One, that apparently I have been doing all the attacking and they are lilly white.... as they saying goes, it takes two to tango, the fact that I am having a battle of wits with some unarmed people is not my fault.
Second, since I have put the gaggle of clowns on ignore, I have not responded to any of their comments since I don't read them, yet every time I post something there they are, hell even threads I start there they are. When you aregue with a moron, people looking at the argument don't know which is which, so in that vein I have decided to stop arguing with them and ignore them completely, yet they are still trying to argue with me judging by the number of times I see their names after my posts.....which only confirms what I have been saying all along, they are stupid and don't get it.
Third, QT and Ralph can ban me if they wish, this is only a forum and I don't spend as much time in it as the "professional" photographer who is most likely supported by his wife, judging by the time he spends on this forum. Yet, if there is going to be any banning, I would think that the fair thing to do would be to ban all sides not just the one who the cry babies want gone.
In the end this is a large format photography forum not a site dedicated to all formats, and specially not a site dedicated to dslrs because that is all they can use. Whatever is the opinion of my work by people in this forum, the undisputable fact is that I AM a large format photographer, all my photographs are made with LF cameras, something that cannot be said by the pretenders.
Don,
You have probably noticed this trend that David is talking about - it happened quite a few times just recently: there was a thread about using digital with LF that got moved to the Lounge precisely because of this type of behaviour. Then there is another current trend about the Nudes and there is also this thread...
As for the "We", well, as someone whose family, job and other such details were all dragged through the gutter in the course of these "discussions", I can certainly agree with David's assessment. And there were quite a few others as well.
I really doubt you would be so sarcastic and even insulting to those who complain about insults if you found yourself on the receiving end. Disagreement over something is one thing, shouting abuse and hurling profanities is quite another. Perhaps it might be easier and better for the health of the community to handle one individual (or perhaps two?) doing that than ending up with a board that nobody wants to risk participating in?
Well, that is the issue for me. If a person needs to use digital for commercial work, or for any reason prefers to do so in personal work no one should have a problem with their decision.
The issue is that much of the comparisoin testing is inaccurate, misleading, and in some cases I would suggest deliberatly manipulated to show digital in the best light. This is especially true of much of the stuff that comes out of Luminous Landscape, which is commercially vested in pushing digital. One of the prime examples was that testing done a few years back in which the conclusion of the tester was that the DSLR he was using clearly beat 6X4.5 and Pentax 6X7. That testing was one of the poorest use of methodology I have seen, but the conclusion stuck and many people are convinced that current DSLR easily beats all MF, and that is just plain BS. There are many factors involved but for my own work Mamiya 7II is without doubt superior to 21 mp Canon DSLR in any print size over about 22 inches in one direction for B&W printing. At that size the resolution of the Mamiya 7II system is about 3X what you can get with the Canon, a maximum of about 3.5 lines/mm with the Canon to about 10 lines/mm with the Mamiya. I would certainly accept the fact that the 21 mp Canon offers some creative possibilities that you won't get from the simple Mamiya rangefinder, but as I noted before, I use Mamiya 7 in situations where LF is not practical, and don't want or need these features.
Sandy King
Or to put it in really simple terms:
My understanding is that the moderators are here to moderate and participants to participate.
If select participants are allowed to moderate the entire board using profanities and personal attacks as their main moderating tool, it should either be officially announced as a change of policy or handled appropriately. Ignoring it will not make it go away.
I think that is precisely it. Why is it that every post of his has to be a veiled attack on someone. Notice the comments about my wife supporting me (she doesn’t). Or that I can’t be a real photographer because I’m on the forums all day (Actually, as my professional work is primarily digital, where else would I be but on the computer processing images when I’m not on a shoot…..and really, the question should be reversed….why isn’t he in the darkroom?)
He again calls people a moron & stupid. And finally, it is odd that he calls a number of people “pretenders.” How exactly are we all pretenders. We shoot with LF. We shoot with various formats. I’m not sure how that renders someone a pretender. He uses the DSLR comments to attempt to make out like he is just trying to keep those topics off the board….but you quickly see otherwise. It doesn’t matter what the topic is….he often resorts to the namecalling when he doesn’t agree.
Rather than accept the fact that people don’t always agree, he attacks you personally with insults and then somehow thinks he’s won an argument. That is what is most hilarious about the whole thing. We can see through all the contradictory posts that have been made. We can see when the story is twisted in yet another attempt to win an argument.
The sad thing is I think he believes it makes us angry….when in fact we are laughing at him and how sad it really must be!
Sandy, your post is bang on correct. A lot of us have had an issue with the methodology on the LL site!
Okay I'll come back just for a minute.
Don and Jorge why all the anger and sarcasm? Why can't you discuss these issues without insulting people?
Marko, I agree in principal but have to admit I like a spirited discussions with opposing viewpoints I don't mind if it gets a little heated.
Sandy, I would never tell you or anyone else for that matter what or how to shoot
It's your photography do whatever makes you happy and gives the results you want. Heck I used to shoot 1600 ASA 3M trans 35mm pushed to 3200 and dupe it to 8x10 for one client.
Finally, to all,what is large format anyway?
Does hanging a back on my 4x5 count?
If I use a quad stitch back?
Is it a film vs digital deal or square inches to megapixels?
Can I stitch together 300 mb of digital info using a DSLR?
Does my Crown Graphic count or is it view cameras only?
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